Interview with TAROT

Hello! It is Adam. Welcome back to bringing it backwards. A podcast where both legendary and rising artists tell their own personal stories of how they achieve stardom. On this episode, we had the amazing opportunity to speak with taro over zoom video. Taro has such a cool story. She's one of the very, very few independent music artists who are selling their songs as NFTs. So if you have any interest in NFTs or buying or selling, selling your own music, this is the episode for you. It is so interesting. Jordan was born and raised in thousand Oaks. She now lives in Nashville, went to college out here in Nashville and is making a killing on her songs independently via NFTs. 3 (2m 12s): She talks about how she sells these, the community she's built online through crypto crowdfunding. She's releasing her record via NFTs. It's just such a fascinating conversation. If you're interested in NFTs, if you're an artist trying to make money, it's sell your songs as NFTs taro knows what's going on with that stuff. You can watch our interview on our Facebook page and YouTube channel at bringing it backwards. It'd be awesome if you subscribe to our channel like us on Facebook and follow us on Instagram, Twitter, and Tik TOK at bringing back pod. And if you're listening to this on Spotify or apple music, Google podcasts, it would be awesome if you follow us there as well and hook us up with a five-star review, 4 (2m 59s): We'd appreciate your support. If you follow and subscribe to our podcasts, wherever you listen to podcasts, 3 (3m 5s): We're bringing it backwards with taro. Hi, how are you? 5 (3m 11s): Are you sorry? I just had to go turn off the TV real quick, going on for the cat. 3 (3m 18s): That's all good. I appreciate you doing this. Thank you so much. 5 (3m 21s): Thank you for having me. How are you doing? 3 (3m 23s): I'm doing well. I'm doing well. How are you? 5 (3m 26s): I'm doing great. You know, Monday morning. Let's get it well afternoon, I guess, but 3 (3m 32s): Sure. Yeah. Are you, you said, are you in Nashville? Is that what I read? 5 (3m 36s): I am. Where are you? Based 3 (3m 38s): Nashville as well. Yeah, I know. Well, I'm south I'm south of Nashville. I'm not sure if you're actually in the city. I'm not 5 (3m 49s): Where it 3 (3m 50s): Williamson county. 5 (3m 52s): Oh yeah, no, I'm familiar. 3 (3m 54s): Cool. Awesome. Well, I'm Adam and this is about you and your music career. And I want to learn all about the NFTs and all that stuff you have going on. 5 (4m 3s): Got all the T. 3 (4m 5s): Cool, cool, cool. So I guess first off, are you born and raised in Nashville? 5 (4m 9s): I I'm not. I'm actually from just north of LA city called thousand Oaks. 3 (4m 15s): I know I'm from, I'm from Southern California as well. My wife was born in thousand Oaks. 5 (4m 21s): That's what a coincidence. Yeah. I've lived in Nashville for the last six years. Came out here for school. I went to Belmont university 2019, studied songwriting is your business and just here chilling, doing my thing, but 3 (4m 37s): Right on, that's amazing. So a thousand Oaks beautiful area. How do you get into music? 5 (4m 45s): I mean, I guess I was just really from a young age, I was just like, my family just recognized. I was very musically inclined, loved to sing, loved to perform, played piano, you know, very like typical joined the school choir, nothing crazy, not like any crazy family backgrounds in the industry. So a lot of people always ask, like, why would you move away from LA if you're trying to pursue a career in music. And it was just, I didn't really know anything until I moved to Nashville because that was kind of my way to break into the industry, you know, and like do my thing. And so I've learned so much being in Nashville. Yeah. That's kind of how like music started for me. 5 (5m 26s): It's just always been kind of my thing. I just, I'm super passionate about creating music. And when I moved to Nashville, I really developed my passion for writing and over the past year and a half, I've really developed my passion for producing. So it's just continuously evolving and I'm super blessed to have something like that. Yeah. 3 (5m 45s): Sure. So what was the first instrument you learned? 5 (5m 48s): Piano. 3 (5m 48s): Okay. And how, I don't know if you said that. I couldn't remember if you said the age, how old are you at piano? 5 (5m 53s): I was three. I actually 3 (5m 55s): It's really young. 5 (5m 57s): Yeah, no, it was just that thing. I guess when I was super young, my parents just noticed I loved music and they put me in this music class and it was just, the rest is history. Yeah, it was, I was classically trained for like 10 years, but then I had just like stopped when my parents got divorced and then, you know, move on and then, but I S I still love piano. I'm just not as good as I could be if I say. Okay. 3 (6m 22s): Okay. But you can, you still play I'm? Sure. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Cool. And then, yeah. So when you started songwriting, when do you fall in love with that? 5 (6m 33s): I actually wrote my first song when I was six years old. It's super cheesy. I was, it didn't even realize it was really doing that. I was just outside with my dad and he would just like mess around on the guitar. And we wrote a song called happy family forever. 3 (6m 48s): Yeah. That's cool. 5 (6m 49s): Yeah. No, it's, it's stuck around, so it still exists. Every time I see him, he was like, can we play it? 3 (6m 55s): Oh, really? 5 (6m 56s): Yeah. 3 (6m 57s): I just play. Does he play an instrument then? 5 (6m 60s): Yeah, he plays guitar and it's always just been like a hobby for him, but like recently he's been getting more into it because I was just in LA actually like a month ago and got asked to play this, what? Three showcase music showcase like randomly. And I was like, ah, I need like a player. And so I was like, dad, do you want you? And it was super sweet. Oh, that's 3 (7m 19s): Cool. 5 (7m 20s): Yeah. We did a little stripped down set and we played happily family forever. So, you know, 3 (7m 26s): Wow. That's the test of time. 5 (7m 29s): Yeah. And then I didn't even know though that like songwriting was songwriting. If that makes sense. Like, I just had a journal growing up and I would write lyrics and sing and poems, and I just loved it. But you, if you're not told like songwriting is a thing, then you just kind of assume like the artists to hear on the radio. Like they write their songs or you don't really. Yeah. And so then when it came to like, oh, what am I going to do for college? I saw at Belmont offered the song writing program and that really interested me. And I was like, Hmm, what a cool way to approach the industry instead of just being like, I'm a singer, you know? And that's really how it developed. 5 (8m 11s): I had to like write a couple songs to get into the songwriting program, moved to Nashville and you know, it just, the rest is history just kept writing and meeting up with people and collaborating and just learning, I guess, like my wet, like paving my sound through the years of just like writing. And 3 (8m 33s): Before, before you got into to Belmont, where you writing and showing people your songs, like how did you know that you're good at it? Like, how did that how'd you get confidence? 5 (8m 43s): I would write. So I guess my family would just like, be like, oh yeah, like you should be like, you'd be a great songwriter. And I'd be like, oh, okay. Like, sure. Which is hilarious. Cause then I listened to the song that I submitted to get into Belmont. I'm like, oh my God, 3 (8m 58s): Really 5 (8m 59s): Not like that bad, but you know what I mean? It's just like, you see the improvement, which is a good thing. But I think that songwriting is something that is like, you can't really teach it. It's innately within you. It's more of peeling back the layers and discovering your voice and what, how you can really tell a story, you know, through words, through music. And I think it's super fun just to begin with, like, I could write songs all day long and be happy, but yeah. 3 (9m 29s): Were you like writing and performing out in thousand Oaks at all? Or was it something you kind of kept yourself? 5 (9m 35s): I mean, everyone in my community knew I was like a singer. I would do the talent shows. I was like in choir. And I had like the confidence to like audition for the solo or like put myself out there kind of a thing. Like I think it was just how I was raised. But songwriting wise, didn't like, realistically looking back, didn't show anyone, any of the songs that, 3 (9m 60s): And then she submitted to, to go to college. He said, he didn't like, you know, at least you have one of them you didn't like, and what was that process? Like, do you just record it at your house? Did you pay somebody? Like, did you go in the studio and then you send them to them and then how did that work? 5 (10m 15s): So this is my first studio experience. Actually. I had a friend who had a mom who had a mom who had a friend who was this retired musician lived out in Ohio, California. Sure. Mick Fleetwood's property actually, which 3 (10m 34s): Is crazy. 5 (10m 36s): Yeah. I don't 3 (10m 37s): Like musicians live out in Ohio. 5 (10m 39s): Yeah. I don't blame them. It's chill. But I went over there and paid him to do these two demos and it was my first experience. And I'll never forget it. I remember like having a full day in the studio did not go to the bathroom once to not eat. Didn't think about it having like the time of my life. And I'm like, this is exactly where I'm supposed to be. And so moving to Nashville and then being immersed into that kind of world, it just feels like home, you know, 3 (11m 8s): <inaudible> so you get to Belmont and then you're just what taking classes on songwriting, building that and going to sessions and going to like what the writer's rounds and stuff like that. Or are you doing any of that? 5 (11m 19s): Yeah, I did a couple of writer's rounds. I, it was primarily more like the country singer songwriter, artists that were going out doing the writer's rounds. I've found that like at Belmont, you kind of figure out your scene that you want to kind of enter and like really involve yourself in. And it's good to like be part of like everything and go to all the shows. But I was making like, or I do make more like indie pop alternative R and B kind of stuff. And that is actually super common at Belmont. It, it, people kind of assume that it's going to be mostly the country, the, you know, singer songwriter vibe, but I guess music row Nashville is historically known for that side of the business, you know? 5 (12m 6s): And then you see this underground scene of an unheard talent. And so it's just really inspiring to, I guess, collaborate with certain peers and then get outside of that Belmont bubble and start branching out to musicians that are just in the city and different producers, you know, sessions writing for, I I've done some writing for other people, but usually honestly, like I have primarily written like, as, you know, you pick your, like your role in the room and you're like, oh, for today, you know? And so I have like, yeah, I have that experience under my belt just by being here for the past, you know? So 3 (12m 47s): That's interesting because when I moved here, I thought it was a country done. Also. I'm not hip to a lot of country, but when I got here, I'm like, oh, people are like, oh, that's a country town. Not really. I mean, there's people from, I mean, all walks of the industry here, a lot of people that I would never have guessed lived in Nashville or Franklin, or, you know, wherever about around here that are writing like pop punk or like old rock bands or, you know, just not country, which is so interesting. And so many huge songwriters are here writing the biggest songs on the radio that you'll hear. 5 (13m 23s): Oh, absolutely. I feel like productions like in LA and then the writings in Nashville, you know, artists are coming out here and be like, what, what are the songs? You know? 3 (13m 32s): Yeah. The songs are here. Exactly. It's crazy. There's something here. So how do you then tell me about this NFT thing? Cause I've only heard one thing about songs as NFTs. And it was when I interviewed rain from the band, our lady peace and they did their whole record and they were doing and have T's with the songs. And from what I got, this is just what I'm going to say about it. Cause this is all I know you could invest in a song on their record and if it did something, so say you invested in track three and then that song becomes a hit. And then it gets on the radio and it's getting, you know, it's making money outside of record sales. 3 (14m 13s): You could benefit from that based on the percentage of that song that you own. So that's what I know. And that's what I gathered from my conversation with him. Other than that, it doesn't make any sense to me. I don't understand why people are spending money on digital art. Like none of it. Yeah. I would, I really need to know all about this. Cause my son was all like telling me I should buy all this stuff. He's like, well, I'm going to invest in it. I'm like, who's going to buy a digital image. It didn't make sense. I mean, I understand it, but I also didn't understand it. So please explain, 5 (14m 45s): Oh my gosh, I have that same outlook as well. I didn't know what an entity was until December of 2021. So pretty. And I was just like annoyed that I kept seeing stuff about it and not knowing what it was. So I just looked it up, started to learn. And then, so when I first looked up like NFTs, I was learning about the PFP projects, like the JPEGs and like the animation cartoons. Okay. Like what, but then something clicked in my head as a music artist. I was like, is there now a way for me to utilize this space, to build an infrastructure for me to, you know, propel my career and like fund the things that I want to do that I feel limited to because I don't have finances. 5 (15m 27s): And so I started to think about different art that I could, you know, start pairing with my music. Like my first idea was to do like Tara cards and have a song about paired with each taro card. And then as I started to like get into that world, I realized how extensive something like a PFM project would be. I'm like, all right, I'm seeing things about music NMT is that sounds like something I can do easily low risk. Like I make songs every day anyways. Why not just try? So I'm like a week before February, I had done like so much research in the space and learning about smart contracts and just all the terminology, because it's very confusing when you just look at it and you can say like, why would someone invest in something? 5 (16m 14s): Right. And so what I really learned is that it's so much more than just that piece of art, that song, that JPEG, it's more about like the blockchain and the technology and the future of how that's going to kind of integrate into society. So I was viewing it as kind of like, you know, like before the internet was a thing, gaining an early and starting to think of ways to use that in your respected industry to kind of shift the way that things are moving because the music industry right now is pretty stale. And th there's not much room on how you can be creative in like popping off your career. It's really this model of post three times a day on Tik TOK make a trend like dah, dah, dah, dah, and like no hate hold a respect of the people that are killing it in those areas because that's a grind, but it's not for everyone. 5 (17m 9s): And record labels are going to be attention to you unless you have those numbers already. And there's so many talented people that I am in contact with in the city. You know? So it's like, all my friends are creatives and producers writers, and they're just getting burnt out because they're not necessarily content creators. I'm not a content creator. I love to make music. I still think as an independent artist, it's a job and you have to do things you don't like to do, but there's a way to do things that aren't just what society says you have to do. And so that's where the NFT hype kind of started for me. And what I learned was essentially, if I'm able to create my own smart contract that lives on the blockchain, I now have full control and the creative control ownership of this project. 5 (18m 2s): And I can take it with me anywhere. So that's what I did. I went and used this no code site called manifold.xyz. So any artists who are interested, you know, I always recommend starting there because the number one thing that I think a lot of artists get really excited about, like the money hyper, whatever about NFPS, they are making the same mistakes as if they were in web to right. Like, oh, this crazy deal, I'm going to sign it, but it doesn't read the fine print, you know? And so I think it's super important to treat it similarly. But anyways, that's just a little tidbit. So maybe the contract. 3 (18m 42s): Yeah. 5 (18m 44s): I think I want to put out a song every single day for the month of February as an MFT. And like just teach myself like fully immerse myself for the next 28 days of February in web three in the community, learn how to manage all that stuff. And that's what I did. So I made a song every day produced. It, wrote it, mixed it. And I did it all on my own. There was a couple of songs that my roommate also co-produced on take gardener and he's on one of my usual collaborators, but yeah, at the end of the day, like I wanted to keep it simple because I didn't want to have to deal with that equity and the splits and like the questions that were in the air. 5 (19m 28s): Cause I didn't know anything. And yeah, so I did that and essentially these songs that I was listing I did as one-on-ones. So each day was a new one-on-one song that I put up and essentially the story behind the project is like, this is just like a song diary. Like I'm just, this is the most inner world of me as an artist. Like I'm writing just at like a flow state. And it's my introduction to the community to really bring in those fans and people who resonate with the music and who I am as a person so that I could, you know, go after all the other goals that I have with my music that I came in with. 5 (20m 12s): Right. So it was like, it wasn't like, this is my mid big project of the year. It was like, this is my Hey project, but it's sounding like the, or starting a foundation of what I call the soul tribe. And that is essentially getting rid of that middleman because now those fans are the investors as well. And they have this role now in the progression of my career. And like last night I just shared a SoundCloud link of all the rod demos off the album. That's coming out this summer with those collectors and they get to help make decisions such as like, which one gets the music video. One should be a single, like acting as that a and our board. Right. And it could be expanded into so many other things in a space, which is what I've been learning. 5 (20m 57s): And so like after doing that for a month, I did a music video drop on glass XYZ, which is a music video or just a video and a T platform in the space and experimented with minting additions. And I know this probably all sounds crazy. Like, 3 (21m 13s): No, no, no. It's making sense. Wait, sorry. Real quick on question here. So what'd you say about this? So there's different platform cause I'm like totally they'll have a clue. Yeah. So I'm not going to pretend like I can get like down to the details with you because I really am trying to, because this is also fascinating. I think people will be fascinated by this, especially since it's actually lucrative to you. Correct. I mean, you've made money off of this and so backup a real quick. Okay. So you have this idea of you're like, I'm going to turn these songs into NFTs. So you then put these songs up on said what? Like where do you go to public songs? 3 (21m 54s): Okay. Yeah. Let's start with Pete. 5 (21m 57s): Yes, yes, no. Please ask me all the questions I can go off on tangents millions. 3 (22m 3s): I love this. 5 (22m 5s): So there are multiple platforms marketplaces, I guess you could say, or music specifically there's catalog there's sound, you know, there's open. See, you can put a music NFC anywhere. 3 (22m 21s): Yeah. Open sees the one I've heard of. I think that's probably the big one, right? 5 (22m 25s): Yes. But here's the thing. So I mentioned smart contracts earlier with open. See, when it's easy for you to go post an NFT, right. Anyone can go do that. But once you were uploading or minting and NMT on open, see, you're mentioning it on the open sea smart contract. So essentially say 10 years down the road, open sea just disappears. So does your NFT, so does the value that you were setting up? So it's so important for artists who are trying to build their own business essentially to have their own marketplace. And so as a musician, I saw that there was certain popular marketplaces that were catering to music NFTs, but they were all submission based like kind of that same gatekeeper mentality of what to write. 5 (23m 13s): And so I didn't want to wait around to get accepted onto the music. NFT platform is for me to put out a music entity. So I made my own smart contract, brought it over to zuora.co and I chose Zuora as the marketplace because they're more of a protocol if that is what that is. And so it's like a pro it's like the, on the development side, I had all learned all this, like recently too. Like I might not be explaining it correctly, but basically it's just, it's taking all the politics out of it. It's this is for the public to utilize. And so I listed my collection on Zuora and they don't take a percentage of any of my sales. 5 (23m 53s): I get everything. But with that, I have to pay my full gas fees. So each day of minting, the NFTs that month costs me around like 70 to $150 a day, depending on the time I was minting. And so there's, you know, but like to me, it's like an investment in myself. It's the same as if I'm investing in like Facebook ads or I'm investing in a photo shoot for it's, it's going to come back to you because you're setting your prices at a price that will return the rate. And so I was able to keep going throughout the month and mint those because of the sales I would make in the month. You know what I mean? 3 (24m 33s): Minting those Le let me go to that term real quick. So that is what, how frequently people are going to see it. Like, what is that doing for you? And why would you be spending 70 to a hundred bucks on it per day? 5 (24m 47s): Well, so minting is just getting it on the blockchain. It's honestly the con of web three. 3 (24m 54s): Okay. So it's on the blockchain, but how are people then finding you and finding that song and then buying it, 5 (24m 59s): That's up to you honestly, it's the same thing as like you go to school for songwriting, like you're not going to be the most 3 (25m 5s): Current writer 5 (25m 7s): Out there and do it yourself. So it's an opportunity I think for artists because it's so brand new, I like to compare it to like the start a Tik TOK, YouTube, you're a creator and you're tapping into early, like 3 (25m 19s): The last P there's less saturation right now because you can get in there early. There's not a, it's not now, like if I, if you started a tech talk today, I mean, there's already people that have hundreds of millions of followers and to catch up with them is probably hard or something to non 5 (25m 35s): And the cool thing about it too, that just differs the community from anything I've ever experienced. It's just how supportive and open it really is. And it's just a change of pace. I think in the music industry, specifically, a lot of that gatekeeping mentality that like, I'm too cool for school. Like you can't reach me once I reached this level of success, like it's really like the wild west. We're all out here at whatever levels of our life, whatever age, like just pursuing our passions into very unique projects, like what I'm doing in the space as a musician, why would I keep that all to myself? 5 (26m 15s): Like you wouldn't as a musician who wants to do something in the space could not do what I'm doing because this project is specific to me and I can't do what you're doing, but it's now removing that single player mode and going to multiplayer mode, realizing that there's value in growth in the community and who you're connecting with. And for the first time ever, I've really like connected with other artists and musicians in a way that I feel is difficult to accomplish in our social media age life. Right? So it's been super inspiring in that way and to be an independent artist, just like being able to be seen and heard by these people. It's like, you're now at least for me, my goal is quality over quantity because the quantity will come naturally. 5 (27m 3s): If you start with like setting out that intention to build a foundation for yourself as an independent artist, like not just, I need this money right now to like pay for this music video. And then I'm like hoping for the next thing, like, how do I make it into a community that could thrive? That's more than just me as an artist popping off, but like me giving value and bringing all that experience into this community as well and growing together and all of this is like also an idea, right? Like it's, it's trying to set out to do something like this and nothing ever goes to plan exactly how you think it, but there's this new opportunity now that for independent artists specifically, I think web three, you'll never find an opportunity like this. 5 (27m 50s): Again, it's kind of like SoundCloud when it first started, you know, you have Just chance to really like stand out as an artist. You don't have to be the coolest looking person on Instagram. You don't have to have a million followers on Tik TOK for someone to listen to your music. You just have to be a good person, have a good story, have a good intention behind what you're doing. And the rest just kind of attracts to you. And it's a grind for sure, because it's like, non-stop web three's bath, but you get used to it just like any other kind of work, I guess. 3 (28m 28s): Sure. No, it's true. But so then people are what they're, they're not because they're just what buying a percentage of the songs that you're putting out like that. So how does Sony is going to invest money in you? Like what is their, yeah. Like their, it's not like a Patrion, like they're not paying you to like have access to your content. Are they? 5 (28m 47s): It could be. So here's the thing when you're selling a song as an NFT, you're not selling away the rights you're selling it as a vinyl collectible. Think of it like a vinyl piece. Like I love the rolling stones and I got this exclusive like, box, like something like that, but on the digital side. So now it's like, how do you entice people to buy it? If you're a nobody, right? Like, oh, like by my like exclusive entity, like if they're not already listening to you as an artist, now you build utility. And so what you were saying earlier about that once you buy this NFT, now you get a percentage of the royalty cuts or it could be anything. It could be that, or it could be as small as just like now you're a part of like this private discord channel and now you get access to like exclusive merch drops or yeah. 5 (29m 39s): It's really it's sky's the limit. 3 (29m 42s): Yeah. That makes sense. Okay. But as an independent artist, you just have to keep pushing yourself and pushing like what you're doing to get people interested. 5 (29m 52s): Yeah. 3 (29m 54s): Wow. That's a lot, but I mean, it's cool. It's definitely a new space, right? You're not in like an oversaturated area and there obviously are people going there to like discover are people discovering new artists through this as well, obviously. 5 (30m 9s): And I just expect it to really continue to grow. I feel like every single day, since I've entered the space, I am meeting someone new that is of value to me or I'm value of to them in some way. And then it connects in some way. And it's just crazy because now you're connecting with people all around the world. It's like this global industry of creatives and innovators. Like if you think about it, music needs tech. It's like a revolution, things start shifting in a positive way. And so now, because we're in this early stage of figuring things out, like, what is this, what does it mean? Where is it going to go? 5 (30m 49s): I think it's really important for people involved in the space to have to be involved and like really learn about what's going on and be like that pioneer to lead it in the right direction. Because just like anything, anyone can come in and take over and do what they want to do. But right now I see such a strong morale that I've just never seen before. That goes beyond business. It goes beyond the money. It's about raising the collective consciousness and being a better society and doing what you love to do and not like slaving away at a nine to five. And it's really dope. Like I'm seeing people in their later years of life, quitting their jobs finally, and making art, doing woodwork, like you find your niche and then you find a community and it works and you can really take it to whatever level you want. 5 (31m 40s): And some people just want to be what three artists and make some money and live their life. Me. I want to use web three, utilize the tools to propel and build my career as a music artist in what to do. You know? So it's now finding a way to build my own personal model of connecting with these investors and collectors and building that fan base that is more of like an intimate relationship than just, you know, putting all my energy into outputting the singles out, putting the tech talks and getting all the followers. Cause how many of those people are actually buying your merge? How many of those people are going to your shows? You can't track it, but now with the blockchain, you can track it. 5 (32m 22s): Like every wallet address, like, you know who say, I have a tour and I sell NFTs as my tickets. Now I know who every single person that came to my show, I have their wallet address. I can send them free shit. I could do cool things for my community. You know? It's like the more it grows, the more I can give back and message. 3 (32m 47s): Yeah. I mean that, what you're doing makes so much more sense to me than like the actual imagery NFTs. Because when it comes to that, like my son was like, these monkeys are really popping up and I'm like, okay, so you're going to buy this monkey and the person selling it to you is like a known seller on, on the, on the blockchain or whatever. So their, their stuff is like on the main page and then you're going to buy and you're going to own one. You're going to be sitting back here with a billion people in front of you. Why is, if you spent a hundred bucks on this image, who's going to go find you owning it back here to pay for it. 5 (33m 22s): That's a good question. Yeah. 3 (33m 24s): And I don't know how that works now. It doesn't make any sense to me. 5 (33m 27s): It doesn't make that much sense to me either. That's why I kind of strayed away from the PFC idea when I first started learning about it. And I was like, this is a little too complicated. Like, it feels like really exciting right now, but I don't know how long-lasting that model is, but for music, I'm just like all in I'm super bullish as they say, 3 (33m 50s): Yeah. I mean, this is great. This is yeah. Cause like I said, with the, with the images, I'm like, well, okay, I can buy an image of somebody that's a known seller for a hundred bucks. And then now I want to try to sell it for 120 bucks. But no, one's going to find it because I don't have any like presence in the market. 5 (34m 9s): And a lot of that is like just luck too. And that's just what the market kind of is. It's if you're a really big crypto whale, I think you're very tapped in to everything and you know, more, but if you're just like us who are just trying to like flip fantasy and try something out, like it really is confusing. And so that's where a lot of hesitation comes in because there's no guidebook and it's a risk. It's all like, 3 (34m 34s): Yeah, to me that, I mean, from what he, how he was explaining to me, it just seems like I'm like, there's no, yeah, to me it was like, that's just, you might as well take a hundred bucks and just burn it because the, the, the, I don't know, likelihood of selling something or becoming some rare thing that nobody else cares about. Anyway. That's just my tangent on that. 5 (34m 53s): But then if you think of it from a music standpoint, say someone buys one of my NFTs right now. Right. One of my, from my marathon, the one-on-one those like literally will be nowhere else, except for right there. Like for the rest of my, like, I will be doing music and releasing all that, but that was a specific, special project. So then 3 (35m 12s): It's something they can listen to. And physically there's some physicality to it in a sense that they can hear the song and, and have ownership of the song where if it's just an image, like, I guess you could post it on your Twitter or something. I mean, I don't know, 5 (35m 26s): But with this, it's like, long-term value. Think about it if like Drake was starting out right. And put out an NFT and then five years later he's blowing up it's Drake and were one of the holders of him when you first found him. Now it's like really cool for that fan and collector because they're like, wow, I was a curator. I found this guy and now I can flip this NFD five years later and make a shit ton of money. Yeah, 3 (35m 52s): Yeah. Yeah. Cause now it's like, I can sell this exclusive song that it has 5 (35m 57s): Literally made it happen for Drake to even be Drake because you invested for him in his early career to even blow up. Right. So it's like, that also is like, you, it's a trust thing. It's like, you just kind of make those decisions on your own. Like, you can't really like convince someone like this is worth this much right now. Like it's just up to you as the buyers that resonate with it, then like, holy shit, like that school, or like a guitar, right. You buy a guitar in the seventies hold onto it and you can sell it for tenfold. Like that's how I'm viewing my movement in the space. Really. It's like, this is me as an independent artist, let's build a community and let's like, make all these dreams come to life. 5 (36m 41s): Like, let's do the videos. Let's do the documentary. Let's do the short film. Now we have the resources to do that. And being in Nashville, being in the music industry and learning, I, I know what that means. Like when it comes to the marketing and that side, I just never had the resources or the ability. And so now I see an opportunity to kind of build that from the ground up. And now I'm just like, I hope this can inspire other artists to realize that they have more control over their careers. And they think because I've definitely been in that place as well, feeling like, well, like to be an artist and like live the dream means I have to work like three to five side jobs so I can make my songs and maybe one day off, you know, but now it's like, I have more control I'm in the driver's seat. 5 (37m 29s): I'm the CEO of my music. No, one's giving me that green light, but myself and the people that believe in what I'm trying to do authentically will be the ones that are part of that versus the middlemen who don't have any part in the process, taking a huge pie of what you are doing. So 3 (37m 49s): I love that. I love that. Well, that's what you're doing is so cool. And I'm, I'm this, I know, like in five years I'm going to come back. If somebody will find this and be like, oh my gosh, like she knew what she was doing and that's why she's a millionaire, billionaire, whatever. 5 (38m 2s): So 3 (38m 6s): That's so rad. Well, I appreciate your time today. This has been so cool. Like thank you, Jordan. I do have one more quick question, I guess. Now if you have any advice for aspiring artists. 5 (38m 17s): Yeah. I mean, my advice is like, just put it out. Like just try, like, I feel like even in the web through space, I've been having this thought and like conversation over the past week, actually with people who had just have so many opinions on how people move and how people decide to go about their careers. Like as long as you're intentional behind what your vision is and what you want to it out in the world. Like no one can tell you, otherwise let us speak for itself and just keep doing it. You know, it's really like, it's like going to the gym, putting in those reps. I really learned a lot from doing the music marathon alone by having to show up and push myself to create in ways that sometimes are uncomfortable for creatives to create.