BiB: Cecilia Castleman: Riffs, Truth Bombs, & Making a Record with Don Was: Road to Breakthrough

0:00 What is going on? It is Adam welcome back to Bringing It Backwards, a podcast where both legendary and rising artists tell their own personal stories of how they achieve stardom. On this episode we had a chance to hang out with Cecilia Castleman over Zoom Video. Cecilia was born and raised in the Nashville, Tennessee area. She grew up in Franklin, Tennessee and talks about how she got into music. She does come from a very musical household. Both her mom and dad are very accomplished songwriters here in Nashville, so she grew up with guitars around her and obviously songwriting in her blood. But she started playing guitar at around 6 or 7 years old and started writing her own songs around 11.

0:44 Cecilia talked about signing a publishing deal at 18 years old, what it was like working with some of her favorite songwriters and her favorite producer and all about her brand new album. You can watch our interview with Cecilia on our Facebook page and YouTube channel at bringing It Backwards. It'd be amazing if you subscribe to our channel like us on Facebook, follow us on Instagram, Twitter and TikTok at bringing back pod. And if you're listening to this on Spotify, Apple Music, Google Podcasts, it would be incredible. If you follow us there as well and hook us up with a five. Star review, we'd appreciate your support. If you follow and subscribe to our podcast, we're Wherever you listen to podcasts. We'Re Bringing It Backwards with Cecilia Castleman.

1:30 You may have heard of HelloFresh. They are the number one meal kit in America, making home cooking easier with chef crafted recipes and fresh ingredients delivered straight to your door. But this fall they're serving up even more to love. This isn't the HelloFresh you remember, it's bigger. HelloFresh has doubled its menu. Now you can choose from 100 options each week, including new seasonal dishes and recipes from around the world. Dig into bigger portions that'll keep everyone satisfied. HelloFresh is healthier. Feel great with an even healthier menu. Choose from 15 + High Protein Recipes each week with options like grass fed ribeye or lamb chops. HelloFresh now helps you eat greener one with new veggie pack recipes that have two or more veggies per dish. HelloFresh is even tastier.

2:21 Now get steak and seafood recipes delivered every week for no extra cost. Now with three times the seafood options. Savor the season with hearty fall recipes like Classic Beef Chili or Honey Glazed Pork Tenderloin. Discover new seasonal produce each week from leeks to broccolini to Italian Eggplant and more. How are you doing friends? It's Adam from bringing it backwards. And we love hellofresh in this household. We just had the brown sugar bourbon steak with apple pan sauce, mashed potatoes and broccoli. We love it in our house. Love the fact that it comes right to the door. I know exactly which day my box of hellofresh is coming. It just makes meal planning so easy. Everything comes right in in the bag.

3:08 No trips to the grocery store. I had the sour cream potatoes. I had the steak, chicken stock, brown sugar, broccoli, apple. Everything came right in the bag. So easy. We again, absolutely love hellofresh in our household. And the best way to cook just got better. Go to hellofresh.com bib tv10fm now to get 10 free meals and a free breakfast for life. One per box with active subscription. Free meals applied as discount on first box. New subscribers only. Varies by plan. That's hellofresh.com bibtv10 to get 10 free meals and free breakfast for life.

3:58 Bringing it backwards, Bringing it backwards. Bringing it backwards. Bringing it back. Bringing it back. Bringing it back. Hi, Cecilia. How are you? Hey. Good. How are you? I'm fantastic. I appreciate you doing this. Thank you so much. Oh, thanks for having me. I'm a big fan. I. I watch, I watched the Patrick Journey one that you guys did. Oh, awesome. Two, right? There was two. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Two with him. That's awesome. Thank you for checking those out. Oh, yeah, for sure. Cool. Oh, I'm Adam, and this is about you and your journey in music.

4:40 And we'll talk about the album you have coming out on on Friday. Cool. Sweet. So I always kind of start off with your origin story. Where were you born and raised? I was born and raised in Franklin, Tennessee. Tennessee. Born and raised here and yeah, I just live up here in Nashville now. No way. So you're. I recently moved to just south of Franklin about four years ago now from San Diego, but. That's awesome. So you're. You grew up here and so you've seen the massive change, I'm sure, in everybody moving out this way. Oh, yeah. It's changed a lot. But I mean, all my family's here. My dad's out in Columbia and my brother's in Brentwood. And yeah, we're all kind of scattered out, but it was nice growing up in Franklin.

5:31 It's pretty grown up now, but when I was there, I lived, you know, by cow fields and. And all that stuff. It was nice. That's amazing. Yeah. So you grew up in a musical household as well. Correct. But both your parents Are song songwriters or musicians of some capacity? Yeah, my. Both of my parents are songwriters, super dreamers. My mom, like, showed me everything I knew, and my dad was always, you know, super profound and showing me, you know, I don't know, he very much thought in his own way. And, yeah, it was nice to. To have parents like that growing up and super supportive and, yeah, it was fun with that. Like, did you grow up learning an instrument? Like, were you drawn to what they did? Is that kind of what got you into it? Oh, for sure. I mean, that's like, what I lived and. And breathed growing up. And there was always, you know, a guitar within reach. And, you know, also, though, it was something free for me to do. You know, instead of giving me 20 bucks to go to the mall, it was like, you know, here's a guitar, and that will keep you busy. And. Yeah, yeah, it was fun. That's awesome. So where did you, like, grow up with them writing songs around you, like, or any. When you got interested in it, were they very helpful for you as far as that goes?

6:50 Oh, yeah, my mom was super helpful. I remember growing up and my dad liked to ride in the kitchen, and so there'd be times, you know, he'd be riding and, you know, we couldn't go get a snack or, like, go in the fridge or anything, but that was his place. And, yeah, my mom showed me everything. I know, and I feel like she would be, like, the best A and R ever. Like, she just knows great music, and so it was. It was nice to have her. And she would listen to my songs, and, yeah, I trusted her. And, yeah, she's the best. Cool. So at what age do you start? Like, do you learn guitar at a really early age? I mean, it sounds like they're accessible to you. So, like, at what age do you become interested and want to start trying to learn how to play? Yeah, I remember we. My mom got me a little classical guitar, and I was probably six then, just playing around and. And hearing them play. And then I started writing when I was 11, and, yeah, just. Just been doing it ever since. And I'm very, very grateful. So. Very, very cool. And then do you start showing people your songs? I mean, 11's young, right? I mean, are you. What age do you start showing your friends? Or maybe playing, like, a coffee shop in Franklin or something like that?

8:14 Sure. I didn't. No one knew that I, like, loved music as much as I did, like, in high school. Like, none of my friends knew. I just kind of kept it to myself. But my parents knew and my family knew. But I think it was so sacred and important to me that I didn't want any, like, outside opinions about it. Oh, sure. Especially too, like, I didn't really want to go to college. I didn't. I knew this was, like, what I wanted to do. And, yeah, I just tried to work really hard at it. But, yeah, nobody knew back then, really. At what point do you start showing somebody? Like, was it like, well after high school, or was it when you put out your first song? Is it like, hey, look, actually, I've been doing this for a very long time.

9:01 Oh, gosh, I don't know. I think it was probably a little after high school where I was just a little more, like, confident to show. To show people. And it, you know, I got a publishing deal, and so it kind of became my job. That was like, the coolest thing ever, but that's what I did. And I was always in sessions and it was cool. I was lucky to grow up that way and just sort of kind of slide into doing what I love. I feel super grateful. So, yeah, I mean, having your parents in the industry and as songwriters, I'm sure that was helpful as far as, like, kind of understanding, like, what the process is. I would imagine, like, getting a publishing deal. Maybe somebody that is just writing songs at their house, they're like, wait, what? What does that mean?

9:49 Like, like, did they kind of help you as far as, like, laying, like, a roadmap out for how you could actually make this a reality? I mean, not really. I mean, they gave their guidance as much as they could, but they were pretty like, you know, you're. You're. You know, they're very strict when it came to my work ethic. Like, the day I turned 16, I got a job. I was a host. Like, the day, like, you know, 18, I got my publishing deal. And so they were very like, you know, you want to do this? I think they knew how tough it was. They're like, you know, you're paying all your own bills and you're going to do this, and you're going to know the struggle. So, yeah, it was. They gave guidance, of course, but it wasn't like, you know, I would schedule all my own meetings and I would do this, and. Sure, but you kind of knew where did they give you, like, I guess, like, not help, but, like, you would know, like, okay, I have to get a publishing deal. Like, maybe somebody wouldn't even know that is even a step in the process. Right? Or did you kind of just have to figure it all out on your own there. Your parents are just like, yeah, this is what we do. And you can. You can do it, but good luck. They're kind of like that.

11:06 Okay. I mean, my mom was helpful in. In some ways, but, yeah, they're very much so. Like, go do. If you want to do it. Go figure it out. They kind of stayed out of it, which is. I mean, you're out of the nest. Like, figure it out. Yeah. Okay. And how do you get this publishing deal at 18? I mean, are you submitting songs to people? Are you just. Just networking? I mean, throughout your life trying to get in these writing rooms? Like, how does one even kind of try to do this? Sure. Yeah. I went to Blackbird Academy, which is an audio engineering school here in Nashville, so I can learn how to make my own demos. And I knew that if I walked into a publishing deal, I had to. I wanted something a little better than my iPhone, like quality voice notes. Yeah. Yeah. So I'd make my own demos, and I had a list, and, yeah, I would just go around and meet with publishers and see what they thought.

12:11 And. Yeah. And then I was in school college for two weeks, and then I dropped out when I got it. But, yeah, I just, like, I tried really hard, and I don't know. I. I had some great mentors and stuff like that, but they were very much so. I don't know. You just have to put yourself out there and get around town. And, yeah, I was fortunate that I got that. Was there, like, I mean, obviously getting the publishing deal must have been a huge validation for you as far as, like, this is what I should be doing. But aside from that, or was there a song that you released or something that caught attention that was kind of like a milestone for you where you kind of started think seeing things progress. Because I would imagine if you were just, you know, busting your ass and going in and. And recording demos and going to school for it, and.

13:09 And then no one's giving you any sort of, like, recognition or it's just like, yeah, this is all right. You know, at what point are you just like, okay, I'm done with this? You know what I mean? Like, was there, like, a turning point moment or something that happened or a song that did well or something that kind of started the ball rolling for you? Sure. I think when something that. That gave me a lot of confidence was I'm, like, a huge fan of Don was. And like, all of his records. And, like, when my mom and I would go to Best Buy. Growing up, like, all my favorite CDs, it would say, produced by Don was. So when it came time to make a record, I was like, well, I want to do it with Dawn. And I think.

13:57 And everyone was like, what? Like, that's. You know, you're a little, like, low on the totem pole for that one. But my manager sent him my music and he was like, yeah, let's go make a record. And I remember being like, what? Like, this is insane. Like, this is my dream. And I think going out there and making a record, and we had some really cool musicians on it that were, like, my favorite favorites of all time. And I think being around them and they gave me a lot of confidence, and that really helped me just get more confident. And the path became a little clearer when all of those people came into my life.

14:41 But as far as, like, a specific song, I think, like, when I got, like, New Music Friday on Spotify, that was, like, cool. Or there was a song called it's alright that got on a good playlist, so those are fun. But the people that I've been fortunate enough to meet, and I have such a good circle of friends and people I work with, that's like. I don't know, it just. I'm very lucky and I have a long way to go. I'm 23, but, yeah, it just takes time. And I don't know, I just feel very, very grateful for everything that I've gotten to do so far. Yeah, you've accomplished so much. Where did you guys record the album at?

15:23 We made it at Henson Recording Studios in la. Okay. Yeah, I know. Everyone's like, why didn't you make it here? Like, you're from here. There's tons of stuff. I think everyone. It was probably cheaper to fly me out to LA than fly everyone here. It was. It was so, so fun. That is awesome. I love your. Excuse me. I love your style, like, your music and your songs. Like, it's all right. I mean, you brought that one up. And when I first heard that, like, there's no, like, the. Like, it's a guitar riff and then you sing, like, the melody over this really awesome, like, guitar lick throughout the whole song. And it's not just, like, regular. It's not just, like, chords and you kind of singing a melody to it. I just think that's such a unique song. And it. I mean, obviously it has a ton of plays on Spotify, but it's like. I just think that's such a cool approach for For a song, instead of just sitting down. Okay, this is like these three chords, and then we're gonna single across it. It's like this really interesting guitar part that kind of funds the whole thing. Is a guitar. Is that something that you like is, you know, guitar riffs and something. Something you really enjoy doing or writing or. How did that kind of come about? Yeah, I love, like, anything. Anything, like, hooky and melodic to, like, sort of tie up a song.

16:44 I love, like, 1975 is really good at that. I don't know. I. I just love anything hooky. And I love riffs. I love playing guitar. It's like, my favorite thing ever. And I think I was so excited when I, like, discovered, like, everything on the guitar for me is, like, a discovery. And there's so many, of course, endless options and. And sounds you can get with it. But I was lucky when I. When I got the hook for It's All Right because, I don't know, it just makes me excited. And when we play it at shows, it's like, one of my favorites to play. Yeah, it's such a cool guitar part. Like, I mean, it just sounds in the beginning. It's just a rock and guitar riff. And then you sing over, and it kind of just goes throughout the whole song instead of, like, changing into, like, a regular chord. It just stays with that riff. Yeah. Yeah, it's awesome. Thanks. I'm the worst at strumming, so I try to just, like, finger pick my way through life.

17:48 Well, what can you tell me about this album? Like, how was it? How. When did you start writing it? Or is this kind of like, it's going to be your debut album, right? Yeah. So is this kind of like a collection of all the best stuff that you've done over the course of the past few years, or. Yeah. I mean, the oldest song on the record is a song called I Don't Need To Love youe. And I wrote that when I was 15. Oh, my gosh. Yeah, so it's like. It's a compilation of, like, you know, almost, you know, eight years of my life and then. Yeah, I mean, it's just about my life growing up and me observing things as like, a young girl trying to find my way and, you know, prove herself along the way and. Yeah, I don't know. I just, like, all my thoughts and my secrets are sort of in this record, and it just feels true to me and I believe it. Even though, you know, we made the record, like, two years ago, we've just been trying to Build.

18:53 But I, I still love the songs and hopefully people will enjoy them too. I don't know. No, yeah, I, I love whatever I've heard. I've had a chance to hear the album. I think it's really, really good. Oh, thank you. Yeah. When it comes to like the songs that you chose for the album, was it hard to. I would imagine you have a lot of songs over an eight year span. Like, was it hard to kind of sift through to figure out which ones you, you wanted to put on the album or which ones would make the record? Yeah, I pretty much had a list sort of in the back of my mind. Like the songs I think about the most were the songs that I wanted on this record. And Don and I, we.

19:39 He was in LA at the time. It was like a month before we started recording. And he called me, he goes, okay, make a list of all the songs you want on the record. I sent him like a huge link of songs. We'll go over them tomorrow. And I was like, okay, what time? Like, you know, trying to be super scheduled. He goes, I don't know, I'll just call you tomorrow. So I was like waiting by the phone all day, like, hoping my list, well, is this one good enough? I don't know if it is. And so we went through them together and we'd go through and he'd be like, yeah, I got that one. I don't know. Didn't have that one. Yeah, I got that one. Got that one. And like 80% of the songs we had were the same, which made me feel really good because I was like, okay, cool. So yeah, we just went in and cut those and yeah, it was the coolest thing in the world to me. It was like the best month of my life. My mom got to come along and hang out at the studio and we became friends with everyone and yeah, it was a great time. Wow. With, with the songs on this album, like, I mean, spanning eight years. Do you, like, when you were writing some of these songs, did you ever like, you know, show some of the ideas to maybe your mom or your dad at the time or like, did they have any like, I don't know, like co writing credit or. I guess that's a weird way to say it, but like, you know, having that those people accessible to you, like, were you ever like, oh, you should check this out or was it, were you keeping your writing totally separate from

21:10 your parents as far as that goes? Sure. I showed my mom and I've showed some to my dad, but yeah, they sort of. I don't know. I can always see on their face. But, I mean, they. They would sock it to me sometimes if they're like, no, I don't. I don't understand what this means, you know, And I'm like, well, I'm 23, trying to figure out my life. Like, how would I know what it means either, you know, or. But they would always, you know, be like, you know, just make sure every line means something. You know, it was that kind of stuff. Like, instead of like, oh, you need to change this, it was more like, well, just like, you know, you remember in that one song how, you know, this was like this? And I was like, okay, okay. And they were right about everything.

21:55 But, yeah, editing is my thing. I, like, try to write with my heart first, and then I go back with my. But, like, editing is something that I probably need to get better at. They're always helpful, them just existing and having conversations with each other. And they're so funny and country. My dad's from West Virginia, and my mom's from Wyoming and Cheyenne, and so that just. They're just funny people. And they got great stories. So, yeah, it was nice to have them. Yeah. That's really awesome with. You talked about, you know, this. This album is all your. Your secrets and kind of how you feel and what you think was that. Is it hard to be that vulnerable with.

22:41 With certain things? Not really. I would get choked up in the studio. There's a song called Pick and Lose, which is, like, my whole life, and it, like, closes the album. And I. That was hard for me to sing. I definitely had to go to the bathroom and, like, compose myself. But most of them, I think I'd live with them for so long that I was just like, you know, I read the lyrics over and over again that. I don't know, I just became used to how personal they were. And plus, too, like, I'm such a fan of Stevie Nicks and, like. Like Kolobanov and, like, you know, Prince and people like that, where they just kind of weren't afraid to say anything. I love that.

23:34 I hope I get more personal and more vulnerable and more okay with saying certain things. Yeah. Wow. Well, it sounds like. I mean, in a couple days from now, what, Friday, the album comes out, and it's been. You said it's been like, two years since the thing's been recorded and everything. Excited to have us out in the world? Yeah, I. I'm excited. It's been a long time coming. And. Yeah, we'll see. I hope. I hope it reaches where everyone can listen to it. So, yeah, we'll see. I'm excited. Awesome. Well, I appreciate your time. Thank you so much for. For doing this, Celia.

24:15 Oh, thanks. Thank you again for having me again. I'm. I'm such a fan. I watch your. Your YouTube videos all the time. I love it. I have one more quick question for you. I want to know if you have any advice for aspiring artists. Oh, gosh. Oh, gosh. I don't know. I think it's just like, everyone says this, but just like, you know, hold your ground and, you know, make the music that you want to make. It's hard, you know, being. I'm on my phone all the time and I compare, and I'm like, why are they getting to do this? Or, you know, like, all that stuff? But I don't know. I think just take your time on things, and it's supposed to take time and try to get, you know, like, even if it's 1% better every day at your craft, try to do that. And things don't happen overnight. And I don't know, I think it's just, like, you know, stay true to what you love and don't compromise.

25:28 Bringing it backward, bringing it backwards, bringing it backwards, bringing it backwards, bringing it backwards, it backwards.