BiB: Cecilia Castleman: Riffs, Truth Bombs, & Making a Record with Don Was: Road to Breakthrough

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What is going on? It is Adam welcome back to Bringing It Backwards, a podcast

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where both legendary and rising artists tell their own personal

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stories of how they achieve stardom. On this

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episode we had a chance to hang out with Cecilia Castleman

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over Zoom Video. Cecilia was born and raised

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in the Nashville, Tennessee area. She grew up in Franklin,

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Tennessee and talks about how she got into music. She does come from a

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very musical household. Both her mom and dad are

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very accomplished songwriters here in Nashville, so she

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grew up with guitars around her and obviously

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songwriting in her blood. But she started playing guitar at around 6 or

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7 years old and started writing her own songs around 11.

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Cecilia talked about signing a publishing deal at 18 years old,

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what it was like working with some of her favorite songwriters and her favorite

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producer and all about her brand new album. You can

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watch our interview with Cecilia on our Facebook page and YouTube channel at

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bringing It Backwards. It'd be amazing if you subscribe to our channel

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we'd appreciate your support. If you follow and subscribe to our podcast,

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we're Wherever you listen to podcasts. We'Re Bringing It Backwards

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with Cecilia Castleman.

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Bringing it backwards,

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Bringing it backwards. Bringing it backwards.

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Bringing it back. Bringing it back.

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Bringing it back. Hi,

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Cecilia. How are you? Hey. Good. How are you? I'm

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fantastic. I appreciate you doing this. Thank you so much. Oh, thanks for having me.

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I'm a big fan. I. I watch, I watched the Patrick

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Journey one that you guys did. Oh, awesome.

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Two, right? There was two. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Two with him. That's

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awesome. Thank you for checking those out. Oh, yeah, for sure. Cool.

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Oh, I'm Adam, and this is about you and your journey in music.

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And we'll talk about the album you have coming out on on Friday.

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Cool. Sweet. So I always kind of start off with your

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origin story. Where were you born and raised?

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I was born and raised in Franklin, Tennessee.

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Tennessee. Born and raised here and yeah, I just live up here in

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Nashville now. No way. So you're. I recently

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moved to just south of Franklin about four years ago

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now from San Diego, but. That's awesome. So

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you're. You grew up here and so you've seen the massive

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change, I'm sure, in everybody moving out this way.

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Oh, yeah. It's changed a lot. But I mean, all my family's here. My

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dad's out in Columbia and my brother's in Brentwood. And

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yeah, we're all kind of scattered out, but it was nice growing up in Franklin.

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It's pretty grown up now, but when I was there, I lived, you know, by

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cow fields and. And all that stuff. It was nice.

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That's amazing. Yeah. So you grew up in a musical household as

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well. Correct. But both your parents Are song songwriters or musicians of some

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capacity? Yeah, my. Both of my parents are songwriters,

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super dreamers. My mom, like, showed me everything I knew, and

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my dad was always, you know, super profound and showing me,

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you know, I don't know, he very much thought in his own way. And,

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yeah, it was nice to. To have parents like that growing up

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and super supportive and, yeah, it was fun

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with that. Like, did you grow up learning an instrument? Like,

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were you drawn to what they did? Is that kind of what got you into

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it? Oh, for sure. I mean, that's like, what I

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lived and. And breathed growing up. And there was always, you know, a guitar

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within reach. And, you know, also, though, it was something

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free for me to do. You know, instead of giving me 20 bucks to go

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to the mall, it was like, you know, here's a guitar, and

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that will keep you busy. And. Yeah, yeah, it was

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fun. That's awesome. So where did you,

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like, grow up with them writing songs around you, like, or any. When you got

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interested in it, were they very helpful for you as far as that goes?

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Oh, yeah, my mom was super helpful. I

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remember growing up and my dad liked to ride in the kitchen,

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and so there'd be times, you know, he'd be riding and,

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you know, we couldn't go get a snack or, like, go in the fridge or

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anything, but that was his place. And, yeah, my mom showed

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me everything. I know, and I feel like she would be, like, the best A

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and R ever. Like, she just knows great music, and so it

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was. It was nice to have her. And she would listen

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to my songs, and, yeah, I trusted her. And,

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yeah, she's the best. Cool. So at what age do you

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start? Like, do you learn guitar at a really early age? I mean, it sounds

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like they're accessible to you. So, like, at what age do you

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become interested and want to start trying to learn how to play? Yeah,

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I remember we. My mom got me

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a little classical guitar, and I was probably

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six then, just playing around and. And

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hearing them play. And then I started writing when I was 11,

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and, yeah, just. Just been doing it ever since. And I'm very,

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very grateful. So. Very, very cool. And then do you start

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showing people your songs? I mean, 11's young, right? I mean,

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are you. What age do you start showing your friends? Or maybe

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playing, like, a coffee shop in Franklin or something like that?

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Sure. I didn't. No one knew that I, like, loved

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music as much as I did, like, in high school. Like, none of my friends

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knew. I just kind of kept it to myself.

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But my parents knew and my family knew. But I think it was

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so sacred and important to me that I didn't want any, like, outside opinions

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about it. Oh, sure. Especially too, like,

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I didn't really want to go to college. I didn't. I knew this was,

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like, what I wanted to do. And, yeah, I just tried to

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work really hard at it. But, yeah, nobody knew back then,

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really. At what point do you start showing somebody? Like, was it like,

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well after high school, or was it when you put out your first song? Is

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it like, hey, look, actually, I've been doing this for a very long time.

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Oh, gosh, I don't know. I think it

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was probably a little after high school where I was just a little more, like,

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confident to show. To show people. And it, you know, I

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got a publishing deal, and so it kind of became my

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job. That was like, the coolest thing ever, but

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that's what I did. And I was always in sessions and

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it was cool. I was lucky to grow up that way and just sort of

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kind of slide into doing what I love.

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I feel super grateful. So,

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yeah, I mean, having your parents in the industry and as songwriters,

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I'm sure that was helpful as far as, like, kind of understanding, like,

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what the process is. I would imagine, like, getting a publishing deal. Maybe somebody that

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is just writing songs at their house, they're like, wait, what? What does that mean?

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Like, like, did they kind of help you as far as, like,

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laying, like, a roadmap out for how you could actually make this

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a reality? I

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mean, not really. I mean, they gave their guidance as much as they could, but

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they were pretty like, you know, you're. You're.

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You know, they're very strict when it came to my work ethic. Like,

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the day I turned 16, I got a job. I was a host.

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Like, the day, like, you know, 18, I got

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my publishing deal. And so they were very like, you know, you want to do

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this? I think they knew how tough it was. They're like, you

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know, you're paying all your own bills and you're going to do this, and

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you're going to know the struggle. So, yeah, it

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was. They gave guidance, of course, but it wasn't like, you know,

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I would schedule all my own meetings and I would do this, and. Sure, but

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you kind of knew where did they give you, like, I guess,

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like, not help, but, like, you would know, like, okay,

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I have to get a publishing deal. Like, maybe somebody wouldn't even know that is

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even a step in the process. Right? Or did you kind of just

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have to figure it all out on your own there. Your parents are just like,

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yeah, this is what we do. And you can. You can do it, but

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good luck. They're kind of like that.

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Okay. I mean, my mom was helpful

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in. In some ways, but, yeah, they're very much so. Like, go do. If you

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want to do it. Go figure it out. They kind of stayed out of it,

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which is. I mean, you're out of the nest. Like, figure it

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out. Yeah.

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Okay. And how do you get this publishing deal at 18? I mean, are you

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submitting songs to people? Are you just. Just networking? I

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mean, throughout your life trying to get in these writing rooms? Like, how does

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one even kind of try to

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do this? Sure. Yeah.

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I went to Blackbird Academy, which is an audio engineering school

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here in Nashville, so I can learn how to make my own

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demos. And I knew that if I walked into a publishing deal,

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I had to. I wanted something a little better than my iPhone,

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like quality voice notes. Yeah. Yeah. So

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I'd make my own demos, and I had a list, and, yeah, I would just

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go around and meet with publishers and see what they thought.

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And. Yeah. And then I was in

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school college for two weeks, and then I dropped out when I got it.

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But, yeah, I just, like, I tried really hard, and

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I don't know. I. I had some great mentors and stuff like that,

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but they were very much so.

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I don't know. You just have to put yourself out there and get around

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town. And, yeah, I was fortunate that I

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got that. Was there, like, I mean,

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obviously getting the publishing deal must have been a huge validation for you as

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far as, like, this is what I should be doing. But aside

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from that, or was there a song that you released or something that caught

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attention that was kind of like a milestone for

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you where you kind of started think seeing things progress. Because I would imagine

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if you were just, you know, busting your ass and going

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in and. And recording demos and going to school for it, and.

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And then no one's giving you any sort of, like,

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recognition or it's just like, yeah, this is all right. You know, at what point

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are you just like, okay, I'm done with this? You know what I mean? Like,

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was there, like, a turning point moment or something that

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happened or a song that did well or something that kind of started

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the ball rolling for you?

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Sure. I think when

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something that. That gave me a lot of confidence was

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I'm, like, a huge fan of Don was. And like, all of his

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records. And, like, when my mom and I would go to Best

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Buy. Growing up, like, all my favorite CDs, it would say, produced by

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Don was. So when it came time to make a record, I

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was like, well, I want to do it with Dawn. And I think.

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And everyone was like, what? Like, that's. You know, you're a little, like,

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low on the totem pole for that one. But

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my manager sent him my music and he was like, yeah, let's go make a

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record. And I remember being like, what? Like, this is

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insane. Like, this is my dream. And I

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think going out there and making a record, and we had some really cool

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musicians on it that were, like, my favorite favorites of

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all time. And I think being around them and they gave me a lot of

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confidence, and that really helped me

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just get more confident. And the path became

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a little clearer when all of those people came into my life.

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But as far as, like, a specific song, I think, like,

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when I got, like, New Music Friday on Spotify, that was,

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like, cool. Or there was a song called it's

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alright that got on a good playlist, so those are fun.

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But the people that I've been fortunate enough to meet, and I have

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such a good circle of friends and people I work with,

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that's like. I don't know, it just. I'm very

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lucky and I have a long way to go. I'm 23,

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but, yeah, it just takes time. And I don't know, I just feel

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very, very grateful for everything that I've gotten to do so far. Yeah, you've

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accomplished so much. Where did you guys record the album at?

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We made it at Henson Recording Studios in la.

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Okay. Yeah, I know. Everyone's like, why didn't you make it here? Like, you're from

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here. There's tons of stuff. I think everyone.

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It was probably cheaper to fly me out to LA than fly everyone

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here. It was. It was so,

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so fun. That is awesome. I

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love your. Excuse me. I love your style, like, your music and your songs.

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Like, it's all right. I mean, you brought that one up. And when I first

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heard that, like, there's no, like, the. Like, it's a guitar riff and then

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you sing, like, the melody over this really awesome, like, guitar

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lick throughout the whole song. And it's not just, like, regular. It's not

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just, like, chords and you kind of singing a melody to it. I just think

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that's such a unique song. And it. I mean,

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obviously it has a ton of plays on Spotify, but it's like. I

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just think that's such a cool approach for For a song, instead of just sitting

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down. Okay, this is like these three chords, and then we're gonna single across

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it. It's like this really interesting guitar part that kind

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of funds the whole thing. Is a guitar. Is that something that you

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like is, you know, guitar riffs and something. Something

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you really enjoy doing or writing or. How did that kind of come

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about? Yeah, I love, like, anything. Anything,

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like, hooky and melodic to, like, sort of tie up a song.

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I love, like, 1975 is really good at that.

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I don't know. I. I just love anything hooky. And

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I love riffs. I love playing guitar. It's like, my favorite thing ever.

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And I think I was so excited when I,

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like, discovered, like, everything on the guitar for me is, like,

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a discovery. And there's so many, of course, endless options and.

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And sounds you can get with it. But I was lucky when I. When I

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got the hook for It's All Right because, I don't

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know, it just makes me excited. And when we play it at shows, it's like,

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one of my favorites to play. Yeah, it's such a cool

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guitar part. Like, I mean, it just sounds in the beginning. It's just a rock

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and guitar riff. And then you sing over, and it kind of just goes throughout

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the whole song instead of, like, changing into, like, a regular

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chord. It just stays with that riff. Yeah. Yeah,

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it's awesome. Thanks. I'm the worst at strumming, so

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I try to just, like, finger pick my way through life.

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Well, what can you tell me about this album? Like, how was it? How. When

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did you start writing it? Or is this kind of like, it's going to be

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your debut album, right? Yeah. So is this kind of

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like a collection of all the best stuff that you've done

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over the course of the past few years, or.

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Yeah. I mean, the oldest song on the record is a song called I Don't

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Need To Love youe. And I wrote that when I was 15. Oh, my

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gosh. Yeah, so it's like. It's a compilation of, like, you know, almost,

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you know, eight years of my life and

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then. Yeah, I mean, it's just about my

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life growing up and me observing things as like, a young

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girl trying to find my way and, you know, prove herself

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along the way and. Yeah, I don't know. I just,

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like, all my thoughts and my secrets are sort of in this record,

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and it just feels

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true to me and I believe it. Even though, you know,

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we made the record, like, two years ago, we've just been trying to Build.

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But I, I still love the songs and hopefully people

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will enjoy them too. I don't know. No, yeah,

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I, I love whatever I've heard. I've had a chance to hear the album. I

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think it's really, really good. Oh, thank you. Yeah.

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When it comes to like the songs that you chose for the album, was it

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hard to. I would imagine you have a lot of songs over an eight

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year span. Like, was it hard to kind of sift through to figure out which

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ones you, you wanted to put on the album or which ones would make

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the record? Yeah,

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I pretty much had a list sort of in the back of my mind. Like

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the songs I think about the most were the songs that I wanted

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on this record. And Don and I, we.

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He was in LA at the time. It was like a month before we started

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recording. And he called me, he goes, okay, make a list of all

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the songs you want on the record. I sent him like a huge link of

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songs. We'll go over them tomorrow. And

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I was like, okay, what time? Like, you know, trying to be super scheduled. He

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goes, I don't know, I'll just call you tomorrow. So I was like waiting by

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the phone all day, like, hoping my list, well, is this one good enough? I

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don't know if it is. And so we went through them together and

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we'd go through and he'd be like, yeah, I got that one. I

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don't know. Didn't have that one. Yeah, I got that one. Got that one. And

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like 80% of the songs we had were the same, which made me feel

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really good because I was like, okay, cool. So yeah,

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we just went in and cut those and

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yeah, it was the coolest thing in the world to me. It was like the

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best month of my life. My mom got to come along and hang out

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at the studio and we became friends with everyone and

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yeah, it was a great time. Wow. With,

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with the songs on this album, like, I mean, spanning eight

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years. Do you, like, when you were writing some of these songs, did you ever

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like, you know, show some of the ideas to maybe your

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mom or your dad at the time or like, did they have any like,

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I don't know, like co writing credit or. I guess that's a weird way to

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say it, but like, you know, having that those people

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accessible to you, like, were you ever like, oh, you should check this out or

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was it, were you keeping your writing totally separate from

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your parents as far as that goes? Sure. I showed my mom

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and I've showed some to my dad, but

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yeah, they sort of. I don't know. I can always see on their face.

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But, I mean, they. They would sock it to me sometimes if they're like, no,

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I don't. I don't understand what this means, you know, And I'm like, well, I'm

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23, trying to figure out my life. Like, how would I know what it means

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either, you know, or. But they would

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always, you know, be like, you know, just make sure every line means something. You

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know, it was that kind of stuff. Like, instead of like, oh, you need to

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change this, it was more like, well, just like, you know, you remember in

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that one song how, you know, this was like this? And I was like, okay,

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okay. And they were right about everything.

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But, yeah, editing is my thing. I, like, try to write with my heart

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first, and then I go back with my. But, like, editing is

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something that I probably need to get better at.

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They're always helpful, them just existing and having

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conversations with each other. And they're so funny and country.

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My dad's from West Virginia, and my mom's from Wyoming and

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Cheyenne, and so that just. They're just funny people.

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And they got great stories. So, yeah, it was nice

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to have them. Yeah. That's really awesome

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with. You talked about, you know, this. This album is all your.

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Your secrets and kind of how you feel and what you think

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was that. Is it hard to be that vulnerable with.

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With certain things?

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Not really. I would get choked up in the studio.

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There's a song called Pick and Lose, which is, like, my

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whole life, and it, like, closes the album.

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And I. That was hard for me to sing. I definitely had to go

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to the bathroom and, like, compose myself. But most

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of them, I think I'd live with them for so long that

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I was just like, you know, I read the lyrics over and over again

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that. I don't know, I just became

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used to how personal they were. And plus, too, like, I'm such a fan of

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Stevie Nicks and, like. Like Kolobanov and, like,

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you know, Prince and people like that, where they just kind of weren't afraid

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to say anything. I love that.

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I hope I get more personal and more vulnerable and more okay with

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saying certain things. Yeah.

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Wow. Well, it sounds like. I mean, in a couple days from now,

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what, Friday, the album comes out, and it's been. You said

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it's been like, two years since the thing's been recorded and everything.

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Excited to have us out in the world?

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Yeah, I. I'm excited. It's been a long time coming. And.

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Yeah, we'll see. I hope. I hope it reaches

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where everyone can listen to it. So, yeah, we'll see. I'm excited.

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Awesome. Well, I appreciate your time. Thank you so much for. For doing this, Celia.

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Oh, thanks. Thank you again for having me again. I'm. I'm such a fan.

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I watch your. Your YouTube videos all the time. I love it. I have

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one more quick question for you. I want to know if you have any

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advice for aspiring artists.

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Oh, gosh. Oh, gosh.

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I don't know. I think it's just like, everyone says this, but just like,

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you know, hold your ground

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and, you know, make the music that you want to make. It's hard,

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you know, being. I'm on my phone all the time and I compare, and I'm

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like, why are they getting to do this? Or, you know, like,

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all that stuff? But I don't know. I think just

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take your time on things, and it's supposed to take time and try to get,

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you know, like, even if it's 1% better every day at your craft,

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try to do that. And things don't happen overnight. And

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I don't know, I think it's just, like, you know, stay true to what you

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love and don't compromise.

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Bringing it backward,

400
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bringing it backwards, bringing it backwards,

401
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bringing it backwards, bringing it backwards,

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it backwards.