BiB: Mikael Stanne (Dark Tranquility): Swedish Grammy Wins, Bus Rides with In Flames, and 13 Albums!

0:10 Bring it backwards. Bring it backwards. Bringing it backwards. Bringing it backwards. Bringing it backwards. Bringing it backwards. What is going on? It is Adam. Welcome back to Bringing It Backwards, a podcast where both left. Legendary and rising artists tell their own personal stories of how they achieve stardom. On this episode we had a chance to hang out with Mikael of the band Dark Tranquility over Zoom video. Mikael was born and raised just outside Gothenburg in Sweden and talks about how he got into music. Mikael first became in love with music when he started to see different metal bands from the 80s on television. He also had a group of friends on his street who all ended up forming Dark Tranquility.

1:03 But they're all fans of music and started to like heavier and heavier bands. He talked about cassette trading as a way of learning about new bands and discovering new music. Mikael talked about forming Dark Tranquility. He has some wild stories about this bus line that they would take. He lived in the suburbs of Gothenburg and they would take this bus to go into town and like guys from in flames and at the gates would jump on the bus and it was all, all of them hanging out. Mikael also sang on the first demo and the first album for In Flame. So he tells us all about that and Dark Tranquility is getting ready to put out their 13th full length studio album. But he gets into the major milestones of the band, one particular from around 1994. And then he tells us about how the band won a Swedish Grammy in 2020 and how weird it was going to the Grammy Awards, having to be social distanced and texting the other band members that they won because the whole band wasn't allowed to go to the the ceremony. But then he gets into this new album and the differences going into this album versus the other 12 without anders as the drummer. But the new album from Dark Tranquility is called End Time Signal. So check that out and check out the video version of this interview on our Facebook page and YouTube channel at bringing it backwards. It'd be amazing if you subscribe to our channel like us on Facebook, follow us on Instagram,

2:35 Twitter and TikTok at Bringing Back Pod. And if you're listening to this on Spotify, Apple Music, Google Podcasts, it would be amazing if you follow us there as well and hook us up with a five star review. We'd appreciate your support if you follow and subscribe to our podcasts. Wherever you listen to podcasts, we're bringing. It backwards with Dark Tranquility. Hey, how are you? I'm good, I'm good. How are you? I'm fantastic. I appreciate doing this. Awesome. Thank you. My pleasure. I'm Adam, by the way. Nice to meet you. I'm Mikael. Nice to meet you. Cool. Well, this is about you and your journey in music and we'll talk about the new album you have coming out. Yeah, couple months.

3:21 Yeah. Sweet. Awesome. Awesome. All right. Well, I always start off with kind of your. Your personal origin story. So, like, where. Where were you born and raised? 20Km outside of Gothenburg. Place called Bildal, which is. Yeah. Kind of like a suburb along the coast of the west coast of Sweden. Oh, very cool. Down south. So were you fairly close, like the water and everything down there? Yeah, a couple of minutes away. Wow, that's awesome. Yeah. And then lived in this kind of newly built street, at least when we moved there in the mid-70s. And that's where I met all my friends back then. And that's where we started the band. We lived on the same street. No way.

4:09 Okay. That's awesome. As far as music goes, like, you come from a musical household or like a creative family. I mean, sure, I listened to my parents records, but it was mostly, yeah, Beatles, Jimi Hendrix, Tom Jones, that kind of stuff. But it's more when I kind of discovered heavy metal through. Actually it was kind of TV. So in mid-80s in Sweden, it became kind of like a thing to show off the horrors of this new heavier rock. That was kind of, you know, WASP and Twisted Sister, bands like that. And there was big kind of, you know, upheaval among parents. They were like, oh, are kids gonna listen to this horrible music? You know, that is leading them into depravity and whatever. And. And of course, that made us love it even more. And so isn't that funny how like, every time, you know, your parents, like, oh, we can't have them listen, you're just so much more intrigued. You're like, oh, even further, of course, like. So that was. Yeah. And then some and then. But it still wasn't kind of, you know, super, super interesting. It was more kind of, you know, fun. And there was always kind of like, either you're into kind of synth or you're into metal, you know, and that was the big kind of thing. At least in. In our part of Sweden, you got beat up if you're not into metal. And you beat up the

5:41 metal kids if you. If they're into. Not into synth, you know, Depeche Mode and craft Valk. Math. Like that. But I loved them both. I loved everything that was kind of different from what was regularly played on radio. So I was drawn to kind of the heavier stuff. And of course it was Judas Priest and Maiden. And then, as per usual, someone has an older brother who is into something even cooler. And that was the case. A friend of mine, his older brother had some thrash metal albums, you know. And so I got to hear Creator for the first time, Larry EP. And this was in like 88 or something like that, 87. And I was like, this is the coolest thing I've ever heard. Like, I.

6:30 I never want to listen to anything else. This is it. I finally found this. And. And at the same time, there were a lot of us in that area and on our street and we just hung out listening to. Listening to music and. And that was it. Like, that's how we bonded. That's how we. Whenever we met, we just played music to each other that we had found, you know. And back then it was cassettes and vinyl records and demo tapes. So we started getting into tape trading with people all over Sweden and then all over the world just to find more music. Because there was only one record store or there were two, but there were one kind of more underground that. Where you can walk in and go, like, what should I listen to? What should I buy? And they were. You had to trust the guy, you know. Yeah, yeah, that kind of guy working there. So that was cool. But then getting into the underground and tape trading was where it really happened for us, where we discovered this incredible American bands like Atheists and Morbid angel and Nocturnus and stuff like that. And then even more obscure stuff from Germany and South America that we just loved.

7:35 And it became everything. And at the same time, my friend Thomas Limberg, who's the singer for at the Gates, he lived, you know, on the other side of the street. And he was into fan scenes and he had started a fancy. So he got tons of stuff sent to him. So every day I would go over there and just listen to new music and new stuff that no one else had. And it was a fascinating insight into kind of the underground scene. And it made us want to be a part of it, you know. So eventually, you know, after a show, I think it was in late 88 here in Gothenburg, where Creator played. And it was the first time I seen kind of like a international band, you know, here. And it just blew my mind and I decided to form a band and we started the following year. So. So that was it. Like, it's just. Just. And it was, yeah, of course, like a huge impact on us when we were, you know, 14, 15 years old. As, you know, as. There's always something that kind of shapes your life when you're at your most kind of malleable or open to new ideas, or when you wish for something else than maybe what your parents had decided that you should do with your life, you know, it was an escape from the normality and like the. I don't know, like the. Yeah, the most obvious, you know. Sure. You played guitar, right? In dark tranquility in the beginning.

9:02 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Because, like, instrument that you learned how to play. Me and Nicholas, who started a band, we just. We bought guitars and then we learned a couple of riffs and then we sat and tried to copy every record that we liked. And eventually we started writing our own material. And we asked the other guys who lived on the same street, basically, you know, a couple hundred meters away from each other. It's like, yeah, you. You play drums. You're the, you know, the most athletic, you know, strong guy. Anders had the longest hair and he. So he was going to sing and that was it. Like, just see if we can come up with it. And then I moved to a bigger house where we had a garage where we could practice. So we built our rehearsal room there. And then we just started. So, yeah, that was. It's just a matter of convenience, but also, like, how. How important that.

9:54 That part of our lives was and how important music was at the time. Like, it was everything. Like, so. So what was fun was that there was a bus line that led from this suburb of Gothenburg into town, and we would always take the bus into town to kind of hang out, sit in the park, drink beer and bring a cassette player and play music to each other. And so I walked on, on the first stop, and me and Thomas went on. Then the next one was Anders, who's now In Flames, and the other guys from dt, and then a couple stops later, it was the guys from at the Gates and In Flames. And it was on the same bus line, you know, for 30 minutes into town, basically. And then we would just sit there and kind of, you know, just exchange, you know, music and experiences and talk about dreams of starting bands and doing.

10:48 Yeah, something else than what we were doing. So it was a cool thing. Like, it was really kind of bonding, like a time of where we really got to know each other and also kind of start something that we thought was really cool. Not, of course, thinking that this would eventually be, like, considered a scene or an important sound or anything like that. It was just us having fun and kind of trying to impress each other with the music that we were making. You know, let's see if we can make a song that is as good or better than the other band, you know? Yeah, that was it. Yeah. Because at the time, I mean, even now, right, Gothenburg and Stockholm were our huge areas for like the death metal. A lot like death metal scene. I mean, like, so many bands are out of that. That area. I mean, were you like early on? Would you see. I'm trying to think some of the.

11:41 Because it really started what, in like the 80s, right? Early 80s out there. Late, late 80s, I would say late 80s, early 90s. So. Early 90s, yeah. So we started in 89 and then we had our first show in like 90, 91 and around the same time, like Inflame started late in 94 and then at the gates around 93. So it was. But it was just. And the fun thing is like that same bunch of people, like everybody along that bus line and everybody I knew back then, we still hang out and we still kind of talk about those days, but also, you know, still hang out as we've been friends ever since. So it's. It's like I love how. How impactful that was to our lives.

12:26 That even. Even the people who were just hanging out, maybe not in bands or they were in bands for a while, but then realized they wouldn't. But they went on to do something in music or in culture, you know, like one of our friends, she hosts like the big culture TV show. And one of the guys is a. A fantastic writer about metal and rock and hosts TV shows. So everybody went on to do something within the same kind of sphere, which is another testament to how impactful it was too. So nobody kind of grew up and went like, yeah, that metal thing, that was just a face. Yeah, it was never over for any of us. What's wild is like on that one bus line you have you just mentioned three bands that are such massive artists. Not only that, but like so influential to so many other bands. Like, and just they were more in the 30 minute bus line.

13:22 Yeah, there were more to like the Hammerful guys lived during that bus line as well. And so. Yeah, it really was. And it's. Yeah, so it was pretty. Of course it would make perfect sense to us. That's how we kind of, you know, get to see each other. But. Yeah, but it's fun to think about. After all these years, the talent of everybody kind of in that same bus. You played in Flames didn't you? In the beginning, or are you saying on their demo or something? I sang on the demo on the first album. So it was just after we had recorded our first album, Sky Dancer, and I didn't want to play guitar anymore because I was horrible at it. So I started to sing instead. And then Inflame started at the same time and Jesper asked me if I wanted to join because they didn't have a singer. So I said, sure, I need the experience. And then. So I sang on that first album. I was never kind of like a full member or anything like that. We did two shows and that was it. And then they moved on to someone else and then eventually found Anders, who's still there.

14:18 Okay, and you just stayed in. I mean, you were always in Dark Tranquility, right? The whole time. You never left the band. It was just. No, no, you just did that as kind of, what, like a favor to see, like, oh, I'll just get more. You know, kind of like. I just wanted them to get a demo, like to get a record deal. Because. Because I thought the sound on the demo sounded great. But then Jesper called me one day after they said. Or like a couple of days after they sent out their first demo and they said like, yeah, the first guy we sent it to loved it and want to release an album. Can you sing on it? And I was like, no, I don't want my first album as a singer to be another band, you know, not Dr. Quilty. But he said, I'll buy you beer. And I said then, okay. Like, all right. I guess.

15:01 That became Lunar Strain. So. Yeah, so with. Because you said you wanted to help them get a record deal. Where was Dark Tranquility already? Kind of a bit. Yeah, we had already and everything. Yeah, we had already released our first album. So. Okay, so you're on Spine Farm and everything at that time. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Okay. Wow. And even getting that first record deal where you guys just started off just playing. Well, like locally. And then how do. How does the fan base kind of just start build? Was it like a word of mouth? I mean, it's not like tape trading and all. That was a big deal back then. Nobody was still. So it was. Yeah, through kind of fan scenes, small magazines and. Yeah, sending out our demos and we made like an ep, you know, like two song, seven inch.

15:50 And someone in Finland picked that up and Spineform Records wanted to sign us and we said, yeah, let's make a record. But we never thought we would do anything more than that. It Was just a matter of, like, if we have an album, we have done something, you know. And then that album kind of eventually reached Osmos Records in France and they wanted to release something and then some of them restarted. But it was strange. Like, none of us had any idea what to do because the death metal scene was tiny back then. There was not a lot of labels, there were not a lot of opportunities. And, like, you didn't really know, like, could we get signed? We're just a tiny little band here from. From Sweden. Like, there was no way we could imagine us, like, being on the same label as, you know, some of our heroes, you know, that was never even possible.

16:41 Like, at the Gates was the first band to kind of get signed by, what was it? Peaceville at the time. And that was the coolest thing in the world. Like, you had. They had some of the coolest bands that we loved. So. So that was a big deal. And of course, like, it was all about. Kind of realized that, okay, maybe. Maybe we can do that too, you know, maybe that's. That's possible, you know. And so it was. It was a really interesting time. And then it was weird. Like in the mid-90s when we started, everybody released records and everybody was on tour constantly. All of a sudden, like, we didn't see each other anymore. We saw each other, like, at shows and sometimes at festivals. And that's because you're all going your own ways. And as the bands get bigger, it's like, okay, we're going to be doing this. We're on this tour. On this tour. Yeah. What would you say, like, I mean, obviously getting signed and that really kind of kicks the band off and everything else? What would you say, like, another big kind of milestone that you can remember or like. Or what was like the next kind of stepping stone for the band?

17:43 I think it was 94. We. We kind of had changed our lineup a little bit. We brought in Freddie once on a guitar, and I started to sing and we recorded the Gallery and at the same time, and we recorded that in studio. Fredman, who was kind of like a up and coming kind of studio, he recorded some metal buddies had recorded like a demo with a band called Ceremonial Oath that kind of splintered off into In Flames and Hammerfall. Later on they record a demo there and I hung out in the studio and I thought, you know, the guy who ran it was really cool and the sound was great. So. And then at the Gates recorded an EP there. We were like, okay, this is a cool studio now. We record There and then at the Gates and Influence recorded their next albums there. So then the Gallery, Just Erase and Slaughter the Soul came out the same year and all recorded in the same studio and kind of similar artwork and that kind of stuff. And it was kind of like, oh, now there's a scene. And we didn't think of it. We thought, you know, all the bands were very different and they are very much different. But at the time we tried our hardest to be different. And all of a sudden like we go on tour and I remember like going into the bathroom and I'm seeing this flyer on the floor and I go like, okay, you know, check it out. And there's like German band playing true Gothenburg death metal. I was like, what the. What's that? Like I had never heard that, you know, term before. And all of a sudden it became a

19:14 thing like, yeah, that's the melodic death metal stuff is from Gothenburg and they all sound the same. They're all the kind of, you know, friends and playing the same studio. And of course most of that is true, but at the time we felt it was an insult, you know. Oh, I bet. Yeah. Wait a minute. We're trying hardest sound the same. Yeah, to be as original as we possibly can and like it's just part of the scene. Like everything's the same. Of course nobody thought that, but it felt like that. But that's one way those like 95, 96, like that, that changed a lot for us and for all the bands. Like all of a sudden like you got recognition, we got offers for great tours and yeah, so it's been a lot of work ever since then basically. So that was cool. That was a milestone stone in the, in the biggest way that we.

20:07 That in the history of the band, I think. Wow, that's crazy because like, I mean, you're at what, 13, like this, this, this album that's coming out is your 13th studio. I mean to be a band and to, to be able to put out 13 full length albums, like that's just like unheard of nowadays. No, I mean, it's not, but it's. But it is strange. Like I remember thinking at one point when the second Death album came out, I was like, wow, a second album from a death metal band. That's awesome. You know, who knows if this is gonna work because that's what I've always felt like back in the day at least, you know, like, oh, let's do this while it lasts.

20:49 Like, while we can still do it while it's still fun. While People still care, you know, But I don't know if this is gonna work, you know? And then here we are, 35 years later. Wild man. So I just want to. I want to fast forward real quick because I also want to get into this new album. Of course. So the. The album that won the Swedish Grammy. Right? That was a moment. Is that that album? Yep. And were you, like. Because that comes out, what, during the pandemic? Yeah, yeah, yeah. It came out like. Yeah, late 2020. That was crazy. Were you. Did you put that. Were you like, tell me about the album. Was it recorded all prior to. Yeah, we started prior, but we ended up just during. Like, we were supposed to be done by end of February, but then everything kind of shut down by the early February. And then all of a sudden, okay, what do we do? Where do we go? All of a sudden, like, all of our plans that we made about releasing albums and touring and all those things, like, went away. So we ended up spending more time in the studio instead and releasing it somehow. Late. Some somewhat later, but still. And that was a big kind of thing. Like, do we release something or should we just wait? Wait. And of course, like, no one knew how long it would take, so it was kind of like, yeah, let's put an album and see. See what's gonna happen. But that was strange. It really was. Yeah. Tell me. I mean, not only winning the Grammy was kind of, oh, going to a party. Because we've been to the Grammys before. It's awesome. Yeah. You can only go. Two guys in the

22:21 band, and you're not supposed to sit next to each other. Could. We could only kind of party, like, on a big boat, but, you know, really. Wait, hold on real quick. Okay. We had very different restrictions in Sweden. Oh, okay. So. Well, was this the first. You said that this wasn't the first time you had gone. Had you been nominated prior? Yeah, we nominated in 2000, and then, I don't know, 2010 or 15 or something like that again. Okay, so a couple times prior, but this was the first victory. Yeah. So when you get the nomination, you can. Only two people from the band can go, and you can't sit near each other. Like what? I don't know. They were like. There was like, this big theater. Normally it's a big tennis hall, whatever, and, you know, we're a big theater in Stockholm, you know, and it's a big deal, and everybody's there and everybody's, you know, hanging out. And that's part of the fun, of course, to meet like, you know, all these other famous people. Because it was 2020. I see what you're saying.

23:16 Is that why it was all weird? Yeah, it was too super weird. Like, you know, social distancing and make sure everybody had to do the test before we walked in. And it was kind of like just such a weird thing, like. And we were so happy, like, yeah, we won, but then we had to, you know, text to our. The other guys in the band, like, yeah, we won. Sucks that you're home, you know? Right. Oh, my God. Yeah. And the party, that's usually the big thing. It was kind of like, yeah, a couple people on a big boat, you know, the harbor of talking, like, just hanging out. It was still fun, but. Oh, I bet. What a moment, too. I mean, how about.

23:56 That is so big and so validating. I'm sure for you all, even. Yeah, it was. It's not a big deal. I think, you know, we don't really worry about it, but it was still fun, you know? Yeah. As you said, it's. It's recognition, you know, and it's kind of cool that more extreme metal has been up there, right? Yeah, exactly. Nominated even in the US I feel like for the Grammy Awards, for the metal albums, you see some bands that you're like, wow, this band is really heavy. I'm surprised they're actually considered in this category instead of, like, maybe a band that I wouldn't maybe consider a metal band, but. Right. And of course, there was a time where I would go, like, you know, there was a time in history where I would go, like, fuck that shit. You know, why would we take it?

24:41 But now I'm just happy that, you know, people are okay with this kind of music too, you know? Yes. Well, so going into this, this new album, right, this is you guys, what, your original drummer, Andres left. Right. He left the band. So was that. How different was that going into. I mean, you probably, what, put 10 albums or 12 albums out with the guy before. Yeah, yeah, we had, actually. And yeah, it's been there since it's the beginning. And then like. And he's always written tons of material, especially the last two, three albums. Like, he written most of the material, but he wanted to go in a very different direction and didn't really want to do the things that we were planning to do, like just endless tours and that kind of stuff. And it just made sense for him to kind of go, like, I'll focus on something else and do my own thing. And as weird and sad as it was, of Course I understand it. You know, I get it. Like, I don't. I don't want to, you know, have someone in the band who's not, you know, 100% dedicated to it, who really loves it, or, you know, sometimes you kind of fall out of love with something or you find something else that you. That kind of catches your interest. And that was the case. So it was. It was strange, but at the same time kind of liberating because, yeah, going into to writing a new album, we. There was none of the kind of normal way of writing that we'd done the last five, seven years.

26:09 So we kind of started fresh without expectations, without kind of inhibitions, or we could kind of go forward without compromising at all. And I think that Johan and Martin and I really had a vision of what we wanted to do early on. We talked about it a lot, like, how we wanted this album to sound and how we wanted the band to move forward. Like. And we had a kind of like a vision for what it should be. Then, of course, it took forever to get there, but. But it was. But it was different. But at the same time, I think, you know, the three of us have been very kind of. We. We've shared like, a common kind of idea of. Of what this should be. And. And of course, throughout the years that's always been the case. But, you know, you. You have different band members thinking about different things and wanted to go different directions. But here we. I think we were very much kind of sympathetic and aligned in our. In our vision. What would you say, like, going into the album, like, after all that happens, or now you have to, what, find a drummer at this point? Yeah, and do. And do all these things. And then it's like, okay, we. We all have the same idea for. For what we want it to sound like. Do you feel like it was, you know, a big departure from the previous three. Three albums or two albums before that, or. Yeah, big departure in terms of writing, but. But at the same time, it's so much easier. Exactly, though.

27:34 Yeah. No, but, I mean, Joachim is such an incredible drummer. Like, he's such a pro that he comes in like, fresh and he could. He can play anything. So anything we throw at him, he's like, yeah, sure. The first rehearsal we had with him, his audition was kind of 17 songs, and he was like, damn, all right, we're going to play like a show in next week. Like, do you want more practice? Like, do you want to start it with something easy? He was like, no, I got it. And he nailed everything. So he's incredible. And so that's made it a lot of fun to write as well. Like thinking what he could do and kind of like challenging him and kind of pushing him a little bit and to play even faster or heavier or weirder. And it was fantastic.

28:17 And Christian on bass is an old friend of mine who was part of the scene here in Gothenburg in the early 90s. And it just made such perfect sense to have him in the band. And he's just like such a musical mind and such a rhythmic player and easy. So that was amazing. To just like at first kind of expect what it should be or imagine what it's going to sound like, but then also kind of fulfill that and have it sound better than anything we've ever recorded was felt like a triumph once we heard the final mix, you know. Yeah. Because going into. Were you guys nervous at all or were you personally nervous? Like, oh yeah, like, is this gonna be. How different is this gonna be now that we don't have. I mean, I'm nervous, but you know, you trepidatious, you go like, hey, what are we gonna do? Like, what do we need to do in order for this to be different but yet familiar, you know. And so, but. But it was a lot of just us talking and hanging out in the studio make kind of figuring out where to go and trying out ideas and bouncing songs off of each other and rearranging and scrapping and throwing away and starting anew and eventually we, you know, you have to.

29:31 As much as you doubt yourself individually and also as a band, like, we have to trust the process and in each other in order to move forward and because you know that eventually if we are all okay with it, you know, all five of us, you know, it's. It's going to be good. Like I trust the other guys, but I, you know, it doesn't always feel like that. Well, as with any creative thing, you know, you doubt yourself more than. Right, right. You're happy with what you do. You know, if you had all the time in the world, you'd probably just tinker with the littlest thing. You're like, oh, of course, of course. That's with. So when you got. Do you always go in knowing you're gonna write an album or is it just start with songs? Okay, I figured yeah, it had to be that just because you have so many full length albums.

30:19 It's like nowadays everyone, it's more like, oh, we'll have a single and then another single. Every. Every song has to breathe or you know, give it a moment. But I love that you just do a full album. You're like, yeah. And also like, you get into writing mode and kind of like, okay now because yeah, I want, I love the format of an album. I don't. You know, sure, you can release singles and that kind of stuff, but that's just promotion for the album. Right. And then eventually comes out as an EP with every song you've released, the bonus, which is this next single. Yeah, yeah, but no, but we think of it that way. And also, I mean the whole writing process takes. Takes a long time and pre production and everything like that.

31:03 So. So we kind of devote time to. Okay, we now we have a year off from touring. Let's focus on writing and then we, we get into it. So. And we would never. Or I don't think so. I don't think we would work like that if to just like, yeah, let's do a song now and then another song later. It's like, nah, I don't see the point of it. And I don't think we, we would work like that. We've done some, some stuff like that with events, but it's. It's a bit strange to me. Yeah. So do you have like a concept going in? You're like, okay, this is what the idea or is it just. Yeah, I'm ready. Starting point. You know, you start off somewhere and you see where it goes and then you kind of, you know, you kind of distill it down to a certain kind of overall theme or a mood or a feeling.

31:50 And that was kind of clear for us in the beginning. Just knowing that, yeah, this is, this is where we're going. It just felt right. And then we moved from there and. This is the first album obviously since the COVID all that stuff. So this, this is going to. Are you guys going to be back to the. We're going to release this album and do a big support tour for it because you probably couldn't do that as much for. No, we can do any. So. Right. Yeah, so. So yeah, yeah, yeah, that's what we're doing. Like the album comes out during Summer Breeze here in Germany, August 16th. Yeah. And. And I believe the tour starts in August 21st or something like that in Atlanta at Prague Power Festival. And then we tour for five weeks together with Amorphous. So we're doing a co headline tour with them and we've done that before and it's awesome. And we love those guys so much and it just makes Perfect sense. So we're doing that and then it's a European tour immediately after that and Christmas, and then we start the next year with another tour in Europe and summer festivals and then back to the US after next summer. And then, so I'm going to be off next Christmas is what I'm looking forward to.

33:04 Then maybe we could get into some writing again. But that's quite a while. I mean, it's so, it's so wild to me. I mean, speaking of artists and bands, like, you have your whole like, year right planned out, like, you know, where. It's just so crazy to me like that. Well, we're going to be here. We're going to be here for this many months and this many weeks and we're back to the US like, that's awesome. But it's kind of good. Like I keep always looking at my schedule and we have like a, you know, a unified schedule for everything that's going on. So we know that, you know, some. Something comes up and it's like, hey, do you want to go to that show? We're going to that festival. Hold on. No, I don't want to go to actually somewhere else. Like that's the downside, of course. Like, we don't get to, we don't spend enough time at home, but. But it's kind of, you know, ebbs and flows kind of like that. So it's, we're going to try to, to make it more balanced. Like three years ago I was away for 165 shows. I think it was in one year. That's. That's a bit. That's a lot of shows. Wow. Wow. Mikael. Well, I appreciate your time. Thank you, man, so much for doing this. I'm excited for the album.

34:14 I have one more question for you. I want to know if you have any advice for aspiring artists. Ooh. I don't know how things work nowadays, even though I started three bands in the last three years. But it's old timey people who've done this forever, so. No, but it's. I don't know, I think I've always said, like, you know, you have to find your sound first. Like if you think about what you look like on the Instagram or if, you know, you think about the first single and how it's gonna be cooler than anything else, then you're trying too hard, I think rehearsing and finding your sound and playing as much as humanly possible, not necessarily in front of an audience, but just together so that you become a band, then that's where you should start then. It's not easy. It's a difficult scene. It's easy for us when we start a new band with members from other bands. People know what to expect and we could kind of pre sell stuff even though it's brand new but for new bands. And I speak to a lot of bands who are kind of up and coming and they go like, yeah, what should we do? And I was like, I'll try to help you out by sending it to the people I know in the industry. But other than that I don't know. Maybe you build a following. I honestly don't know. It must be pretty rough. But originality will go a long way. If you're a good band that plays well together and has a unique sound, then good things

35:47 will happen. That's what I think. Bringing it back, bring it back, bring it backward.