BiB: M.A.G.S. - How a Family Band & Church Basement Led to Indie Stardom & Touring with Football

0:00 What is going on? It is Adam. Welcome back to Bringing It Backwards, a podcast where both legendary and rising artists tell their own personal stories of how they achieve stardom. On this episode, we had a chance to catch up with Elliot M.A.G.S. over Zoom Video. We had Elliot on the podcast a couple years ago now when he first released the album Destroyer. And this time we had a chance to chat with him about the reimagined version of Destroyer, which is called Creator. Kind of recap a little bit on the first interview, where he was born and raised, how he got into music. He did grow up in a musical family. He talks a little bit about how M.A.G.S. was formed, but you can get. All of that information in the first. Interview we did with M.A.G.S.. So we focus a lot on the new album, which is called Creator, and each track is a reimagined version of the songs from the Destroyer album. He recorded the thing in nine days.

0:59 There's nine songs. They knocked out a song a day. And he kind of talks about the process of that. This is the first time he's really collaborated with anyone on a M.A.G.S. record. So it's a fascinating interview. The album is amazing. And M.A.G.S. is about to hit the road with American Football. We talk about that as well. You can watch the interview with Elliot on our Facebook page and YouTube channel at bringing it Backwards, it'd be amazing. If you subscribe to our channel, like us on Facebook, follow us on Instagram, Twitter and TikTok at bringing back pod. And if you're listening to this on Spotify, Apple Music, Google podcasts, it would be incredible. If you follow us there as well and hook us up with a five. Star review, we'd appreciate your support. If you follow and subscribe to our podcasts, wherever you listen to podcasts, we're. Bringing it backwards with Max.

1:55 Bringing it backwards. Bringing it backwards. Bringing it back. Bringing it back. Bringing it back. Bring it back. Hey, what's up, Elliot? How's it going, man? How are you, brother? I'm doing well. How are you? I'm doing awesome. Thanks for doing this again. Yeah, thank you for generously rescheduling. Oh, yeah, yeah, no worries. And because I had you on when the album came out, before the album came out, before Destroyer came out. Yeah, I think it was the day before. Yeah, yeah. So appreciate it to chat about the. The. The new one or the reimagined version, I. I should say of the. The album. Right?

2:45 Yeah. Yeah. Sweet, man. Well, I appreciate you doing this again. You kind of know the drill. It's about your. You and your journey in music. Since we already heard your story, really the first time, maybe we can just recap a little bit and then obviously get into this new project you just released. Absolutely. Awesome. So first off, I do remember you born and raised in Buffalo, New York. Right. But then you moved to la. That's correct, yeah. Are you in LA now? No, actually at the beginning of this year, I moved to Kansas City, Missouri. Really? Okay. Yeah, I did. I did six years in LA and just kind of was time to go, you know. Got sick of it. Well, not even that I was sick of it. It's just. I don't know, I think most of 2023 I was on the road and there was just a lot of like, circumstances that were kind of pushing me towards like. Okay, I think I need to like, get some space from all this, you know, so. Sure, yeah. Kansas City's cool though. So far. I like it. That's awesome. So why did you decide on Kansas City.

3:59 Mostly? Actually, because my, my partner got a job here. You know, we had been doing kind of the long distance relationship thing for a while. I was in la, she was in New York, and at the end of last year, I moved to New York and spent some time there, and then we moved to Kansas City together once her job started. Okay, right on. Very, very cool. And did you. Was I. I saw something about this new album being done in Chicago though, right? Yeah. Wrong. That's correct, actually. Yeah. I just, I had flown up to Chicago when I was still in la. I just went to Chicago after a tour and like, me and my guitarist, we just like locked away and did it. It was cool. Okay, so you weren't living there, it just happened.

4:45 You happened to do it there. Okay, right on. All right, well, so yeah, you come from a musical household. Your dad was a worship leader. Right. Mom was in the choir, ran the choir. And all your siblings are musical in some form or another. So kind of tell me about like. Okay, you and you started off on drums. I'm curious. We didn't really talk much about the, the first band that you played in, which was with your siblings, right? Yeah, we. We guess. I guess we may have skipped over that a little bit. Um, that was very much just sort of like a product of necessity, I would say. Um, you know, we were all like very, very invested in, in playing music and you know, like, we were all homeschooled as well. So like, there was a lot of like music based themes in the house, whether it be like, you know, Making up songs for school or, you know, my mom would make up a song to get us to do stuff.

5:48 A lot of times, you know, just like, to clean up our messes or, you know, if we needed help with something. She always had a song to, like, kind of remind us to do these things, you know, so. And also we had, like. Like, we would all take turns doing extracurricular activities. So. And we would go, like, by the school year. So, like, I remember the one year my older sister Lydia wanted to learn how to play guitar, so she started taking guitar lessons. And then my bro, my younger. My youngest brother, Christian, he wanted to play bass. And I already kind of knew I could play the drums, like, before I even ever got a kit or anything. I'm just like, I. I know I can. I. I have to, you know. Oh, so you weren't playing already at this point when everyone else was gonna. Say, I didn't start. I didn't start playing until I was like, I think 13 or 14.

6:45 Okay. Like, I would play a little bit. Like, I would try to, like, like, sneak up on stage after church and, like, I would try to hit the. Hit the drums. But I will always get kicked off by the sound guys or my dad or whatever. Oh, really? Like, yeah, yeah, you're just a kid. You're just messing around. And then I'm like, no, I can play the drums. Like, I promise you. But, yeah, I don't know. And then my. I have another sister, Mariah, who's, like, younger than me. She's, you know, I think she started kind of learning piano. Like, my dad started teaching her piano, and, you know, all of us can sing, you know, more or less.

7:26 So it was kind of just like, I don't even. I don't. Honestly don't even know, like, where the idea came from. It seems like it was always just going to happen at some point. But we did start, like, a little band that we. I think it was the majority of the reason was because we were trying to enter this, like, competition at our church. Oh, like a battle of the bands type thing? Not. It was more like a. It's kind of hard to explain because it was. It was like a regional, and then it became like a national thing where, like, all these different churches would, like, come together once a year and they would do, like, you know, like the regional round where you could, like, you know, be in a band or you could, you know, preach a sermon or you had, like, a piece of art that you would make, and then you'd be like, judged on it. And then if you, you know, got a score that was passing, you could go to the next round.

8:26 But it was like a really big event, you know, and if you went to the national, like, you're, you're, you're competing against thousands of other people, you know. So I think we just like formed our band basically to enter that competition and we ended up like, getting to the national level, I think, two or three years in a row. Wow. Were you doing original songs or you do like, like a worship song or kind of both? I think we entered two different categories, so we had a couple original songs that we were doing for that, but we also were just playing like church music, you know. And then we started playing, like, I think we played at the mall one time.

9:09 It was, it was weird, man. Like, I, I think when I look back on that, it was like we're just set up in the food court and like, it was just very like uncomfortable. I remember I was like, kind of upset because I had to play with those like, hot rod sticks, you know, because it's like we're just in like a really big echoey chamber. Yeah, I had to play really quietly and like my whole thing was just to play as hard as you could. So that wasn't really my, my jam. But yeah, I don't know that we ever played any proper, like, shows at a venue or anything like that. We played primarily like at church or, you know, just like little, little things here and there that are parents, friends would have. Like, we, I think we played at like a school one time, you know. Okay. Probably played, you probably played out like, like maybe five or six times total. Okay. And you're one of your sisters is still an artist, right? Yeah, my younger sister Mariah, she still, she still plays. She still records and puts out music.

10:13 She's got her own project that she calls Renee the Entertainer. She's, I think Renee's her middle name. So like, I was wondering, I was gonna say I, I, I had written down Renee the Entertainer. And then I'm like, he didn't say I, did I? Maybe I misheard. Yeah, Renee the Entertainer. That's her thing. It's kind of like a more of like a hip hop infused R B kind of thing. Yeah, the song, I remember, I think she had just put out the song Heart last time we talked. Yeah, I worked on that one a little bit. We, we. I'll send her beats all the time. And she's actually got a new song coming out soon that's like a Boot a beat that I produced. Really? That's awesome. Yeah. Yeah. So we still kind of work together here and there, but she's kind of doing her own thing, which is great. That's awesome.

10:57 And then. So, yeah, and then you kind of started M.A.G.S. by just recording yourself, Right? You'd record the drum beat and then go back in and add guitars and pretty much to it. Yeah. And I had been in so many bands, like, between, like, when we started our first band to. When I started M.A.G.S., I probably was in, like, seven or eight bands. Okay. And then with. With M.A.G.S.zo, I mean, the song Drugs, obviously, is a huge. Was a huge song for you. And was that kind of. What did that change stuff for you as far as, like, the success level of this project versus other bands maybe you had played in before?

11:38 I think having a song that kind of, like, got baked into the algorithm, like, I think it definitely added a bit more, like, legitimacy, you know, to be totally honest, none of the other bands really had enough, like, Juice to really, like, get off the ground. Like, a lot of them stayed local. Okay. Never really toured with any of the other groups. And I don't know, I just. I think it was. It's a lot of the mentality behind, like, starting a band. Like, some people want to get on the road and they want to, you know, play shows and. And do that kind of life. And then other people just want to, like, be local and, you know, just play shows locally and just kind of have something to do, really, you know. Right. I mean, that's the thing that's wild about being in a band, especially bands that are. Have. The longevity is that you have to find a group of, you know, three, four, five people that all have the same dream and the same drive and the same, you know, mindset when it comes to those things. Because for me, I mean, I think about, you know, chatting with artists, and they're like, you know, the rough in eight years, right in the van and sleeping on floors. And I'm like, yeah, that's. That. That's not for me.

12:53 And I'm sure. I'm sure that's not for a lot of people once that you get to that point. But then usually you'll hear about people like, you know, the. The few. Maybe The. The most passionate people in the town or whatever, all kind of get together at one point or another, and then that band goes on to become a success story because those are the people that cared enough to continue on with it. Yeah, I think it's really just about everyone's sort of goals being aligned, which is very challenging, you know, especially getting a little older too, and everyone's priorities start to change or like, you know. You'Re having kids, you're getting married or whatever. Yeah. You're like, I. I got to get to work, man.

13:33 Like, I can't just, like, go play a pizzeria for 10 bucks. That's exactly right. Yeah. I think, you know, it's interesting because I. I watched a lot of the. The people that I looked up to in the scene in Buffalo, like, kind of take that route as well, you know, and there's. There's nothing wrong with that. I think that's like, honestly, like, it's. It's stable, you know, and you. You kind of end up like, you know, you got your house, you got your kids, you got your wife, you know, and you just. You're doing your thing. And, you know, I think there is part of me sometimes that is like, you know, dang, that would have. That sounds really nice, you know, and I. I'm just at a point now where it's like, I'm starting to move more towards that as well, you know, Like, I'm in Kansas City. I'm away from a lot of the distractions of just kind of the big city life and everything. My girl and I are. Are pretty posted up here. We got two cats. You know, it's like sometimes it's kind of like having kids, 5am Wake up times, I guess, sometimes, sure. But, yeah, it's. It's a good life. And, you know, I think ultimately it's like, you know, I'm.

14:44 I'm willing to protect it. You know, this is like the type of stuff that I want to come home to after I'm done being on the road, you know. But you must have some sort of inkling. I mean, like, you'll hear. I'll hear artists talk about. It's like if you sat around for six months or eight months, you'd probably be itching to get out and play. That's me. Right? You know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah. So it's like one of those things where most people are like, oh, it'd be, you know, they do the one show and they're like, oh, that was great. Okay, that'll all. That'll. That'll take care of that itch for the next nine months. Or it's most. If you're. This is it and this is what you want to do, and this is what you love and what you're doing. I could see it being a lot harder to kind of hang up for a long period of time. Yeah, you know, it's. It's interesting you say that because, like, this past year, 2024, for me, has been. It's just been that, like, the last show I played was in December of 2023, and, like, a few weeks before I moved, we did, like, a show for Emo Night out there, and it was really. It was a lot of fun. Oh, that's awesome. Yeah, it was. It was really, really sick.

15:51 And then I moved, and I've just basically been kind of acclimating to life in the Midwest. And, you know, I've been doing some. Some writing here and there, some mixing here and there, but, like, it hasn't really been in the cards to be playing a lot of shows right now, you know? And, you know, that's okay. Like, I'm. I'm honestly totally fine with that, I think. What's like, you know, now that I have a tour kind of on the books, and, like, we're about to go, you know, do this tour and, you know, honestly, it's like I'm about to go open for American Football as well, and that's one of the biggest. Biggest opportunities I've ever had as an artist. So rad. I love that band. They're incredible.

16:31 Yeah, I got to see them last year while we were on tour. We played the same festival. Oh, you played four Chords, right? Was that the festival? Yeah, with Alkaline Trio and a bunch of other bands were on that. Yeah, that was. That was honestly, like, one of the. One of the best experiences at any festival I've ever had. It was. It was really sick. That's so rad. Yeah, I actually. It was crazy. The. The way I even got connected to them was we stayed at the same hotel, American Football and us, like, and we just. We were checking in at the same time that they were checking in, and then we end up. You know, one thing led to another. We were. Ended up. We ended up, like, partying with them. Like, we were just, like, in the lobby, just, like, just kind of tearing shit up, you know. Yeah, it's really sick. But we. You know, I stayed in touch with Steve, who plays drums for them, and, you know, from there we've just kind of been, you know, stayed friends, stayed in touch, and then they asked me to do this, you know, so. That's so crazy. Pretty cool. Yeah. I can't. Yeah, I can't imagine.

17:33 Although you aren't playing here in Nashville, but that's cool. Honestly, I really want to get back to Nashville. I've only played there a couple of times, but it seems that there's a. There's a bit of a demand to come back, so I know it'll happen soon. Yes, I know. And American Football is not coming here either, but that's cool. But you both should. Out of date. But that's. I mean, that's so wild to be able to be on that tour with them. But I was gonna say, like, I know you're talking before. We're kind of talking about how, you know, a bands are hard to keep together and, you know, having everyone have the same drive and the same thing. And with M.A.G.S. is you do everything when it comes to the recording process of it all, but then you have a.

18:16 A live band that you tour with. And I remember we're. When we were talking about the Destroyer album last time, because I want to hear about this, like, reimagined version of it, which is awesome. But you were saying that you kind of wrote that record more so with the live element in mind, Right. Where it was like before, you were just kind of writing the songs, and that wasn't a part of it because it was just you. But then now you have. Then you had a band, you guys started to gel, and then it was like, oh, well, how will this sound live when we play this song? Or whatever with Destroyer? Is that, like, kind of. Tell me about that. Was that because the.

18:57 You have felt like, okay, I have, like, kind of a solid group of people here that are willing and have the same mentality as me, or was it like, I love playing live so much that I want to, you know, this. I want it to sound a certain way live. I don't know. Sure. Yeah. I think there was definitely some realizations on those first couple tours we did, because I had just put out say things, I think, the year before, like, our first tour ever. And even, like, the way that I connected with the guys that were in the band at that point, it was very, like, serendipitous, you know, and when we, you know, started the tour and we're playing shows, it's like, we gelled almost immediately. Like, there wasn't really any, like, period of us needing to kind of get used to each other. It was just like, boom. Like, we're a sick band. And I was like, that was. That was lucky, you know. Right. And, you know, we did, I think, two or three tours, and then I was, you know, I was in the middle of just Kind of getting my. Some of my ideas together for the next album. And, you know, I. I think I'm a pretty observant person. You know, I tend to pay attention to people's like, you know, strengths and weaknesses. And I think when you're on stage with people as well, it's like you.

20:13 You get really familiar with them in like a way that is. It kind of goes beyond like friendship or like, you know, how you relate to them. It's like this almost higher frequency thing, you know? You know, so I would like, listen to. I'd be, you know, doing my parts, but listening to how my drummer is playing the parts that I wrote and I'm noticing how he, how he changes things and how he, you know, is essentially playing the same parts, but like, he's got his own style, you know. And so when I started writing the next album, I'm kind of thinking a little bit about him. I'm kind of thinking about like, like, well, I know he likes to do stuff like this, and so that's a kind of a cool idea. So I might borrow that a little bit, you know.

20:58 Okay, I see. Yeah. Kind of taking like what you're observing when you're playing live, like, oh, like, I never thought about this little thing that he does on this song that, you know, that I already wrote. But maybe we can add something cool like that. Yeah, I think there's. There's a lot to learn from other people. Just. That's kind of an obvious statement. But like, I think with mags, like, it was sort of maybe not so obvious because I started doing it with such like, determination to just do it myself, you know, and since I started playing live more often, it's like, you know, there's a lot of room for other people to come in and like add their style or, you know, just bring their own ideas or their own sort of techniques even and, you know, just kind of put their own voice into it. And I think that's really cool. Like, you know, this next tour we're doing, it's like, I don't even. I have one guy from kind of the original group and the other two guys are new guys I've never played with before.

22:06 Oh, okay. Just. I think it's going to be fun, you know, but it's also interesting because you have to kind of start the whole process over again, like relearning and re acclimating and everything. Sure. So. But I'm really interested to see how, you know, this next run goes for that very reason. And you know, I don't know. I just, like. I like to, you know, now that I've opened myself up to, you know, what other people can contribute to M.A.G.S., it's like I'm sort of itching to now collaborate more, you know, and that's kind of. That's kind of what Creator is, you know, Creator was the very first, like, collaborative M.A.G.S. album.

22:49 Oh, okay. Yeah. I didn't know that. So. Yeah, because I. I remember when you said, like, you went with. With. With say Things or. And you guys would go out and play live. It was the. The songs translate so much heavier. Right. In a live version. Like, a live version. And then. So when it went into Destroyer, you know, it was. This is. It's heavy, and this is what's going to sound like on the recording and live. And then with this new with Creator, it's. You kind of took a. You flipped it again. So now it's more of, like. It's more atmospheric, I guess. I don't know, like, how I would describe it, but it's not. The songs are rad, and it's the reimagined versions, I guess.

23:30 You kind of describe it like, it's not heavy. The newer one. No, it's not. Yeah. So. So, yeah, you kind of went back to more of the, like, less heavy with the same song, like, a different reimagined version of these songs. And, like, I guess. Why. What went into this? Like, why did you decide to do this? And. And you made it a collaborative effort. And how did that all. How did this come about, this project? Sure. Yeah. I think this album started off as an acoustic album. My initial idea was, like, you know, like, I put out Destroyer and kind of immediately jumped into.

24:10 Just kind of getting my personal life back together, if I'm being totally honest. Didn't give it as much attention, I think, as I would have wanted to. And so at the beginning of. I think it was. Yeah, like, the beginning of this year, I kind of was just like, I need to. I want to go back to Destroyer, but I want to, like, go back without. Just, like. I don't know. I didn't want to just, like, put out a video, like, six months later, whatever, you know? So I'm like, how can I. How can I, like, give Destroyer a little bit more life? And the idea to just do, like, an acoustic version of Destroyer kind of popped into my head. So I just. I had the idea I'm gonna just, like, sit in front of my computer for a day and just, like, record all these songs acoustically, you know, just my voice, Naku guitar and you know, that'll be kind of like the next step.

25:09 And as you know, I think I. I got through the majority of the songs. I think there's nine songs on the album. I got through like seven or eight of them. And I hit up Ahmed, who plays guitar in my band, and he's the one who lives in Chicago. And I was like. And I actually now thinking about it, I think this was actually the beginning of 2023 when this kind of started because I had finished May. I'm getting my timeline a little mixed up here, but I was working on it last year. Like the. The demos of it. I was working on them last year and I hit him up and I was like, like, I want to like make a. Maybe like a bit of an overproduced acoustic album, you know, Like, I want to add like all these different elements and, and make it really like, like big, you know, like almost orchestral, you know. He's like, bet, like, okay, cool. So we just. This. We just picked a couple days or like. I think it was like, like a nine day stretch in November last year to just like, like lock in and do it.

26:12 And you know, I basically just pulled up with my voice and the acoustic guitars and we kind of just built everything around it. So I think at the very core of Creator, it's still just an acoustic album, but all the extra layers and textures and a lot of the electronic elements, that was all kind of. That just all came through experimentation. I went in with kind of an idea of what I wanted to do and I left with something that I, A, would have never made on my own and B, kind of like subverted my expectations for what I thought was possible. If I'm being honest, you know, I was like. I think like the first or second day we. We went in order of the tracks, you know. And like the first day it's like we made. We did Destroyer and it was like. Or Sequence one. And I was like, I think by the time we got to the end of it and like we're adding this like crazy, like kind of lo fi drill beat. I was like, okay, I don't know. Like, I have no idea. I have no idea what's gonna happen, you know. And then the next day we did Sequence two or Sins. And like, you know, that one has a bit more of like a. Like a. Almost like a western, like cowboy vibe, you know, like all these songs to me, like, as we were like before we made the songs we just kind of would talk about them. And I'm like, this is what I'm thinking, you know? And I know for, like, for.

27:41 For that one specifically, I was like, I'm just thinking about my cowboy riding into the sunset, you know, that's the exact vibe I want to go for. And so we just would kind of use that as our template and just kind of went, you know, and just tried to figure it out. And even for, like, sequence three, that one was very, like, heavily influenced by, like, the Beatles, you know, we made that one on the same day that the. The John Lennon, like, AI track they released. Oh, really? Remember that? Last year? Yeah. Yeah. We woke up and it was, like, all over our feeds and everything, and everyone just had, like, their own opinions about it and everything. It's like, the first new Beatles song in, like, decades or whatever.

28:22 And I'm just like, why don't we just kind of lean into this a little bit and take the vibe from that and just put it into this one and it worked. You know what I mean? It's like we just kept it, like, very, like. I think we referenced, like, sergeant Pepper and, like, the song Day Tripper for some of the guitars and. Oh, yeah. You know, we just kind of, like, just leaned heavily into it, you know. And what we came out of it was, you know, what we got. It was like, oh, this is. This is cool. This is actually really cool. And it, like, gives the song a completely different vibe that, like, you know, it sounds like a different song. And that was when I was like, this isn't. This isn't a remix project anymore. Like, this is. These are. These are.

29:07 This is a different song, you know? Right, right. Yeah. Because it wasn't like, you're going in with the idea, like, oh, that's what this. This song is kind of about, this subject matter, so we can kind of make it this style. It was like, whatever you've kind of felt at the time it went that. That's what went into it. Yeah, exactly. And I think that's like. That's kind of the cool thing about collaborating is, like, to have that idea and then to just sit there and try to do it yourself. It's like, you know, maybe. But I think when you have another person or a couple other people, like, at your disposal, and they have their own ideas that they can inject into it, it's like, you know, I got to just kind of sit back and just watch. A lot of the time, you know, I'm just like. I would sit there For a couple hours and like make a beat or like add a little verse thing. And then I would just like back off, you know? And then Ahmed would come in and he would do some stuff for a while. And then Mike would come in and he would do some stuff for a while. And we just kind of went in a circle for nine days. Were you guys doing a song a day? Was that like, kind of the, like. Yeah, Sequence one was done on day one, or did you not go in order? Or did you go in order? We went in order until I think we went 1, 2, 3, 4, and then we skipped to 9. I don't know why we did that, but, like, that was just what we were feeling. And then we did sequence seven, which is the one that has the video. We did that one on the very last day. Oh, okay, Floyd, I think is that one right, Floyd?

30:39 Yeah, we had to get up early to do that one because Ahmed had to fly out of Chicago that day. So we got. We got up at like 8 or 9 and just like started. And that one came together like, extremely quick. I think we had that one pretty much ready to be mixed by like one, you know, which was really. Was that the fastest one? I remember you're saying, like, when you wrote Drugs, that you wrote that song in like 30 seconds for like a friend's. It was 30 seconds. Yeah. It wasn't. It like, okay, I already have this. He just wrote it down and it was this huge song. But did all. Was that. Was Floyd the next one that kind of came that quickly? Or did. I mean, that obviously didn't take 30 seconds, but you know what I mean. Was that from that album, Was that the. Was that the fastest song that you guys have put together? That was definitely the fastest one. Yeah, I think it was just because we. We had that sense of urgency of like, if we don't finish this today, then we're kind of screwed, you know, so let's. I think we. I know we started with kind of like a pre made beat. And you know, our. Our kind of like, system was like just to take what we had and then layer a bunch of guitars, you know, Molly acoustic guitars over it. Just like a bunch of different melodies.

31:52 And then we'd add the drums, and then we'd add whatever low end bass or whatever. And then we just kind of would build everything out from their textures and like, you know, cutting things if we needed to. And yeah, a lot of it was just like. A lot of it was already there. You know, we put some reverb on the vocals. And it was just like, okay, like, this is the vibe. Like, let's just. Let's just lean into this, you know? Yeah. I was curious about the vocals because they've been on sequence one. I mean, with the song itself on Destroyer, your vocal is. You're. You're singing such a higher oct. It sounds like you're singing in a higher octave. And then in the sequence one version of that song. Yeah, I actually just pitched the vocals up. I just used like a plugin.

32:35 Just like. Okay, yeah. Because there's no way I could sing that high. It sounds great. I didn't know if maybe was like the. The vocals that are on. On the recording in that first acoustic track. Did you keep all that or did you re. Record it the. When you were there in Chicago? No, those are all the original vocals. Yeah. Oh, wow. Yeah, I just. I just pitched them up and I'm like, this sounds great. Let's just. Let's go with it. And did you come up with, like, an idea? You said like, you know, one song at the Beatles Vibe or the Western vibe. Like, was that an idea? Did you have, like, a concept like that going into each song? Each sequence? Almost every song. Yeah. I don't remember all of them, but I know for like.

33:20 Yeah, obviously sequence two was the western thing. Sequence two was the. The Beatles thing. I remember for sequence four, which was. Which is swimming, we had been going for three days nonstop, and both of us were pretty tired and feeling a little, like, drained, I think. And we hadn't left the house either. So we were just like, locked in, just like, you know, not stopping at all, basically. So we decided we were going to, like, go out for a walk and we were going to also, like, collect some sounds. You know, my. It's funny because, like, my initial idea for swimming was I had a dream that I was. I don't know if I was. If I was like an orca or if I was just like, like, like observing like a whale basically. Just like zooming through the water and, you know, you just. You're kind of like looking at all of the different, like, sea life below you and then, like, you. And then for the. For the verses, like, you kind of come up for air and you see like, the sun and you dive back down. It was all very, like, surreal and sort of strange. But that. That visual has kind of always stuck with me, you know, So I was like, how can we kind of make this song feel more like that?

34:39 You know, we actually, like, went down to the lake. And we, like, recorded some, like, sounds from the. From the waves. And we found some, like. Yeah, we found some rocks. It's just like some like, like some smooth rocks. And we banged them together and like, we were just using our iPhones and just like collected like, all these sounds. We took the train down to this. Down to the circle and like, just recorded the train sounds, recorded people, like, just anything that we thought sounded kind of interesting, we just recorded it. And then we just dumped it all on the computer when we got back. And so a lot of the first half of Sequence four is just like, found samples and like, bullshit, really, you know. Really? That's rad. Yeah, but that was like. That was kind of like the. The creative kick that we needed to, like, you know, get inspired again. Cause it was like, you know, a lot of the ideas were. Were just flowing so fast that we weren't really, like, thinking about them. It was just we were doing. And then that day we both woke up, we were just like, yo, like, we gotta do something different because I'm tired, you know? I love that. I had Noah from the band Bad Omens on a while ago, and he was. For one of the more recent albums. That's what he did a lot of that stuff like that, like, he was recording weird things like in his house, like during the Pandemic and utilized on the record. Like, I never heard anyone else talk about that. I think that's so cool that you did that. Like, that's definitely an idea. Yeah, I think

36:09 sometimes just like getting out of the box a bit, you know, because it's like you. You can kind of find any sound that you might want on the Internet at this point, but there's nothing like just getting your own original sample. You know, whether. I remember being at an In N Out one time, and I don't know if you've ever been to In N Out, but like. Yeah, I'm from San Diego. Okay. So you know how they have that machine that they actually like, they make their own French fries. They like put the. Oh, yeah, they. Where they put the full potato in it and go. Yeah. So somebody was like. Someone had like a really good. They had like a good system that they were doing it with. It was making this, like, kind of like crazy, like, rhythm. And I was like, yo. Like, that's like actually a beat, you know? So I remember just like going up to the counter and just like holding my phone, just like trying to get like a. Like a maybe 20 second clean sample of it. And then I just came home and, like, made a beat out of it. Really? Yeah. Like, I think that's the kind of stuff that is, like, that's the kind of stuff that makes me excited about making music is, like, when you hear something, you're like, oh, that's kind of dope. Like, you know? That's so awesome. Did you put a song to it? Like, is that a song? Is that in a song yet? Yeah, it's like, somewhere on my hard drive, I've got tons of music that isn't actually out. That's just, like, sitting on a hard drive.

37:26 That's so cool, man. Well, with this tour coming up, are you going to, you know, play any of the sequence songs, or is it just gonna be rock and roll? It's gonna be, like, a blend of both. Honestly, I want to, like. I know for, like, my. My live shows, I like to keep the energy up. Yeah. You know, I do want to, like, blend in some of the elements of Creator into, like, the Destroyer versions. You know, we do sometimes use, like, backing tracks for. For our stuff live. So, you know, my plan is to have some of that stuff in the track so that, like, when we get to a certain point in the song, it just kind of cuts into the Creator version, you know, and creates this different kind of vibe, you know, so.

38:17 Yeah, but I think realistically, it's like, I. I do want Creator to kind of have its own moment, and I'd like to do some. Some. Some shows that are just creator stuff, you know? That'd be cool. That's awesome, man. Maybe one in Nashville. Who knows? Yes. Do it. Come here. We'll figure it out. We'll get you on a show or book a show. Right on, dude. Well, thank you so much, Ellie, for coming back and. And chatting. Yeah. I love your music and what you're doing. I think that's so awesome you're opening up for American football, too. I mean, what a huge moment that will be or has been with that one festival and whatnot. But I asked you this last time, and it's my last question. I want to know if you have any advice for aspiring artists.

39:06 Advice for aspiring artists? I will give the advice that I have been giving myself lately because I've been in a bit of a, like, you know, creative rut, I would say, lately, and I'm working really hard to get out of it. I actually. I just started this book called the Artist's Way. Oh, pages. This is a. Pages. Doing the pages. Yeah, I'm. I'm doing the pages right now. And it's. It's honestly been really good. But yesterday I wrote like, I was talking to myself about passion, you know, and like, why I started making music in the first place and the things that were inspiring to me and like, the, the motivation that I had to just like, get out of bed at, you know, 2 o' clock in the morning when I wanted to change a mix or if I wanted to get an idea down, you know, like, that was very much like my. My MO for a good portion of my life. But I think having fun and being excited, you know, like, that's to me what passion is. And when it comes to music, if I'm having fun and I'm excited about what I'm doing, then the passion just kind of comes forth. And, you know, there's. There's not really anything else that you need to, like, overthink or take seriously, you know, because at the end of the day, it's like, you know, doing music as a career is.

40:39 You have to be a little delusional to do it. You know, like, you have to believe in yourself so much and believe that you're right, like to a point where you're. You're almost like. Like you can't let other people really influence you very much. You know, not your parents, your girlfriend, like, your teachers. Like, you just have to. You have to believe. And I mean, you see that, like, you know, for the most part, it's like if you just keep going and you just keep. You just stay the course, it's like something will happen. You know, you do find your audience eventually. It might take 10 years, it might take 15 years. You know, a lot of these people that like, you know, go viral or, you know, blow up overnight, it's like you don't see the. The hundred thousand hours of work they had to put in just to get to that moment, you know, but the one thing to never forget during that time is that, like, you're just having fun and you're just. It's not that serious.

41:36 You know, you're just. You're just trying to get your ideas out. You're sharing your. Your own human experience. And, you know, that's. That's exciting. Like, that's like, that's one of the. The greatest gifts that you can give and receive about being alive is just like, you know, sharing your creativity. You know, the numbers don't really matter that much. Your online presence, it's not really. It's. It's intangible. You know, like, if. If all that social media stuff, like, broke or like somebody accidentally deleted Instagram. It's like, what do you have really? You know, you have. You have your own creative experience, and that's. That's the important part, you know, so just. Just keep going, Keep going and have fun.

42:29 Bringing it backwards, bringing it backwards, bringing it backwards, bringing it backwards, bringing it backwards, bringing it back.